A kinder gentler Britain!

[stogie bear]

Do you believe that every single Muslim is a terrorist?

No - but not every single Muslim is British!

[allstar88]

the terrorists arrested in the uk were all doctors or students working for the nhs   what the f**cks going on !?   if islam is a peacefull religion why dont the muslims take to the streets and win back thier religion by demonstrating like they did against the war in iraq or is islam realy evil ?  

[terryw]

The problem with the Islamic relgion is that philosophical debate is suppressed. The result is that the religion is 800 years out of date and incompatible with modern Western Society.

Try criticising the Islamic religion and a Muslim will take offence. By contrast a Christian will frequently accept criticism and join in the debate.

The Islamic religion is a way of life for Muslims requiring them to strictly adhere to the texts of the Koran. Until Muslims are prepared to start a debate about the role of their religion in a modern society, many of them will continue to live in a ghetto and contribute little or nothing to the development of UK society.

[nigel69]

The Germans & Japs put into camps were not all supporters of either Hitler or The Emperor. It would be best to offer a three Month exit, for all Musilms, so that they may return to "fuckistan", or whatever fucked up place they originated from.Their religion and supposed culture is not compatible with our modern societies.Either they renounce Islam or enter the camps.Tear down the mosques, burn the Korans, get rid of the burkha's.
As for Western foreign policy we should be actively supporting each Islamic faction.As it appears that Fatah and Hamas hate each other more than the Jews.Sunni's and Shia's killing each other .Saudi's worried about Iran, etc.If we can keep them busy killing each other, all the better, for a future with less Islamic nutcases.
No more Western retreat.Tell them how it is or tell them to fuck off.

[Tomcat]

Around half the Imams in UK Mosques only speak in Erdu and most only arrived in UK within the last 10 years. They have little concept of European history and culture and what life is actually like for the majority.
These guys are the enemy big time..............

The imams who are a main cause of spreading this shit are living in a bubble. I would put them all on a boat back to Islamabad and name it Titanic II....

send the fuckers back........

[tsadmirer]

Hi again

I don't agree with nigel69's comments because he himself sounds like an extremist to me. I don't know which religion he belongs to but how would he feel if someone tells him the same to do with his holy place and holy book. I'm sure it's not a fair comment.

Although Islam is an old religion but it's guidlines are not out of date. It's the mushroom growth of illiterate, less-knowledgable and narrow minded religious leaders around the world who are the actual cause of this whole mess. You will find several mosques in an square mile area in 'fuckistan' (again swearing can only fuels the problem and it won't help in a solution) but finding an educated and well travelled Imam is next to impossible. They usually came from different mudressah (Islamic Institutes) supervised by some illiterate maulvi who never had a chance to go abroad and meet non muslims. These students are mostly from poor families who let them live in these mudressahs day and night so that they can have food and they become good muslims. You can imagine if a 6 year old kid lived his whole life in the boundary of a mudressah, what will be his approach towards life. On the other hand these students are taught (read brain washed) about only one thing that is Islam is the name of Jihad and the hot ticket to heaven. So, these poor fellas are being used as pawns in this so called holy war.

Every muslim has the responsiblity to help his fellow muslim brothers if they are attacked by enemies for no reason BUT that DOESN'T mean to kill innocent people in the same country they are living in. Islam DOES NOT allow killing of innocent people whether they are muslim or not. If someone wants to fight US/UK army, they should go to Iraq or Afghanistan and fight with their fellow muslims instead of planting bombs that might kill a non muslim who has the same emotions against the war as muslims. But after the death of that person, the whole community will turn against muslims and thats what exactly is happening around the world. Jihad is to fight for your freedom and survival if a war is imposed upon you.

How would you feel if a person throws you out from your home and take control of your wealth. Obviously, everyone will react according to their strengths either verbally or by offering a resistance. I hope most of you will agree that war imposed on Iraq is senseless. No weapon of mass destructions are found. Why don't you let them live their life. Who gives US authority to invade any country for their own personal benefits? Where were US when serbs attacked innocent muslims? Sorry if I sound too harsh but I am just trying to portray the situation that can make any one angry. If I can't respect other's freedom, how can I expect the same from others? War in Iraq and Afghanistan is only for personal benefits. Wouldn't anyone of you like to call Bush a mass murderer of innocent people as well as his own servicemen??

The thing that furstrates me more is that sons and daughters of most of these religious leaders are already studying or well settelled in the countries they pronounce Evil.


Need I say more??

[harley quinn]

(Tomcat @ Jul. 06 2007,08:36) Around half the Imams in UK Mosques only speak in Erdu and most only arrived in UK within the last 10 years. They have little concept of European history and culture and what life is actually like for the majority.
These guys are the enemy big time..............

The imams who are a main cause of spreading this shit are living in a bubble. I would put them all on a boat back to Islamabad and name it Titanic II....

send the fuckers back........

But where would we find the iceberg

I totally support the stance taken by the government of Its the new settlers have to change not the ones who have been here hundreds of years.

Tee up for the next post about aboriginal land rights!

[geezer]

(tsadmirer @ Jul. 06 2007,20:42) I hope most of you will agree that war imposed on Iraq is senseless. No weapon of mass destructions are found. Why don't you let them live their life. Who gives US authority to invade any country for their own personal benefits? Where were US when serbs attacked innocent muslims? Sorry if I sound too harsh but I am just trying to portray the situation that can make any one angry. If I can't respect other's freedom, how can I expect the same from others? War in Iraq and Afghanistan is only for personal benefits. Wouldn't anyone of you like to call Bush a mass murderer of innocent people as well as his own servicemen??

Tsadmier,

First of welcome to the forum. It took a lot of guts to come on this forum and try and put across you points of view. You come across as a moderte and I think sadly voices like yours are not heard enough for whatever reason.

However it must be said it's quotes like this that above re Iraq piss me off. Who gave the Iraqi and Afghanistan people the chance to vote, George Bush. Who is doing the majority (by far) of the killing in Iraq and Afghanistan, muslims. If the war in Iraq is illegal, please tell me a legal one, the idea of a legal war is obsured and dreamed up by the type of liberal who would never fight in a war in the first place. Fact is the Coalition gave the people in Iraq and Afghaistan a chance to come out from dictatorship and join the 21st century. Looks at the moment as though they prefer the 14th. Fair enough there welcome to it, just keep all the crap in their own country and the world can stand by and let Darwinien theory work. So why do Muslims living in UK use their democratic right to protest to deny it to fellow muslims living in Iraq? You live in a democratic country, why are you denying that right to someone else? You say muslims don't want a western way of life, seems to me there are more muslims living in the west than Westerners in the Middle East. Where do you prefer to live?

You ask where was the US in Serbia, I suggest you stop believing all the left wing propaganda and do some reading. Fact is the US left Croatia then Bosnia to the EU to fix as it was seen as a European problem. The EU then being the EU debated it for five years because that's what they do. A lot like their big brother the UN. It wasn't till the US became involved through NATO and started bombing that the Serbs can to the table. Fact is war is war and innocent people will die, but the right to vote is not a god given right. It's something most countries have to fight for.

I don't see muslims as the enemy. I just feel that their community needs to have a long hard look at itself and decide wether they want to inegrate with UK society or if not it may be time for them to move on.

Living in London and getting the tube to work probably makes me al queda sitting duck target number 1, but every time there is a bomb I get them back in my own special way. I go out get pissed and fuck a ladyboy senceless. It's what all those soldiers out there are fighting for.

On a lighter note thank fuck al queda seems to have sent out their Frank Spencer to do the bombings this time. If the guy new his stuff there could have been real carnage.

[nigel69]

hello tsadmirer,

in answer to your question regarding "which religion I belong to ", I actually belong to the most logical and sensible movement of the modern era, atheism.
When ALL phony, ridiculous gods are renounced then much of the evil inflicted by men upon men will have no texts to base itself on.
I presume that books by people such as Richard Dawkins( The God Delusion), Christopher Hitchins( God is not Great) and Michel Onfray ( Atheist Manifesto) are not freely available in Pakistan and if they ever were made available would be top of the list for the book burning ceremonies.I would also presume that not many of your Countrymen would bother to seek them out in Western Countries either.Probably through fear of their fellow Muslims finding out about their blasphemous reading.
Also lets dispel the myth that Islam ( and this applies to Christainity & Judaism also) is a religion of peace and that what is in your holy book is the infalible word of God.
To quote from page 167 of Atheist Manifesto-
"Hitler -Abu Ali in Arabic- admired the Muslim religion in its very essence, virile,warlike,conquering and militant.And many of the Muslim faithful subsequently repaid that kindness:there was the pro-Nazi grand mufti of Jerusalem during WW2,of course,but there were also the eternally anti-semitic and anti-Zionist militants who recycled former Nazis into the highest ranks of Middle Eastern military staff and secret services after WW2,who protected, concealed and cared for many of the Third Reich's war criminals in their territories- Syria,Egypt,Saudi Arabia,Palestine.Not to mention an unbelievable number of conversions of former Reich dignitaries to the religion of the Koran."
page 168:
"The Koran consists of 114 suras.Except for sura 9, each sura begins by repeating the first line of the first sura:In the name of Allah, the beneficent,the merciful.Duly noted.According to Islamic tradition,God has 99 names,the 100th will be revealed only in a future life.Many of these names are variations on the theme of mercy and compassion.Al-Rahim:the most merciful,the most compassionate.Al-Ghaffar:the all-forgiving,the absolver.Al-Ghafur:the pardoner,etc.
"Mercy"may be defined as "forgiveness extended to those one might punish".The specifically religious definition is "the goodness through which God extends his grace to men and to sinners."
In that case, how is it that, among the 99 beautiful names of Allah, there is also Al-Mudhill:the humiliator, the degrader,bringer of dishonour,the creator of death.Al-Muntaqim:the Avenger, the inflictor of retribution.Al-Darr: the punisher, bringer of harm to those who offend him.Debasing, killing,avenging,harming - strange ways to show mercy.But justified on page after page of the Koran."
page 169:
"Allah is constantly presented in the Koran as a warrior immune to pity.Of course he can exercise his magnanimity:it is after all one of his attributes.But when?Where?With whom?There is much more putting to the sword, subjecting to the yoke,torturing,burning,pillage and slaughter than love of one's neighbour.And all this as much in the deeds of the Prophet as in the text of the holy book.Muslim theory and Islamic practice are not shining examples of compassion."
page 170:
"For Muhammad himself did not excel in chivalrous virtues,as his story attests:the Muhammad of Medina was a great raider during tribal wars,rounding up captives,sharing his booty,sending his friends into the thick of the fighting to commit deeds of extraordinary violence.And again,slightly injured by a flying stone, he watches his demoralized troops seek refuge in a trench,entrusting close friends with the liquidation of this or that dangerous rival,happily slaughtering Jews and so forth."
"Magnanimous,then?here is a listing of contrary qualities:Allah excelled in strategy,battle tactics and punishment -including killing (sura 8:30) - he deployed his cunning,that vrtue born of cynicism,more closely resembling a vice than anything else,with flair.He resorted willingly to violence and decided on questions of life and death (sura4:102) he was the master of vengeance(sura5:95) and3:4):he annihilated evildoers ( sura3:141):indeed he practiced that sublime virtue so assidiously that he did not even tolerate a belief that diverged from his wishes:thus he punished those who conceived a false idea about him (sura48).Magnanimity - nothing like it!
page 171:
"Multiple verses in the Koran conflict with the notion that Allah is beneficent & merciful,as he is characterised in the invocation that opens each sura.However the contrary is also true.There is the Koran's injunction to kill unbelievers (sura8:39) and polytheists (9:5), but praise in the very next verse for those who offer them asylum(9:6).We see (in8:39) an order to battle violently against unbelievers, whereas Allah's advice to "pardon them and turn away" could possibly be construed as an appeal for toleration and living in peace.Sura 7:199 reiterates the same idea,expressed as "forgiveness and turning aside".Many verses authorize mass slaughter (4:56,4:91 and 2:191-94).but sura 5:32 (often quoted to refute charges that Islam has a zest for butchery)states that killing a man who has commited no violence on earth is the same as killing all men.
One sura contains prayers to god for the extermination of Jews & Christians (9:30), but a later verse in the same chapter (9:71) says the people of the book are guardians of each other.The Koran affirms the equality of all in the face of life & death (45:21), but describes a father on being told of the birth of a daughter:"his face becomes black and he is full of rage"(43:17).So in countless places the Koran contradicts the invocation of the Magnanimous One with which each sura begins.
Of course Christianity, Judaism,Hinduism and ALL religions that claim the existence of a God/Gods are full of the contradictions contained in the nonsense of the Koran and ALL stand condemned as ancient,backward,tribal rubbish written in times when the fear of the unknown ( mostly the concept of death) that we still display, was even greater than it is in 2007.

Also you typically display the victim mentality so prevalent in most Muslim Countries.Why didn't the U.S. help out against the Serbs?This answer has been provided by my fellow member in the above response and goes to highlight the fact that you want to rely on the U.S. to help you out but also have fellow Muslims who can't wait to end their useless lives trying to kill as many U.S. soldiers/citizens as they can get their hands on.
As I have previously pointed out to you,under the very religion you seek to defend, you would be quickly executed, persecuted or ostacized, if your fellow believers had any knowledge of your inclination to fuck ladyboys.Although I might add that many a Muslim/Christian,etc leader has found pleasure in the arse of whatever boy they took a fancy to.Luckily they were in charge and immune to issuing the order to behead their fellow transgressor .

On a topic in the news,perhaps you would like to comment on the goings on at the Red Mosque, in Pakistan, right now.I see on the news that one of the instigators of this uprising, by a fanatcal brand of Islam, tried dressing up as a woman and skulking out the back door to escape,of course leaving behind his followers to carry on the uprising.Nothing new in this approach by religious fanatics.The leader must always be protected and is most unlikely to ever have to face up to the violence they preach, by leading the charge into battle.
The Shia leadr Moqtada Al Sadr in Iraq, quickly fled to Iran, once the heat was on.

Give up the voodoo nonsense of religion and free yourself to enjoy life rather than embrace the cults of death that most religions celebrate.The writings of scared,bewildered,unknowing tribes put together over Centuries by small minded people should, in this age of evolution, genetic discovery, medical advancement, scientific achievement ( all of which have been opposed by the monotheistic religions, at great cost to human life) let us put these useless texts into the dustbin of history and treat them as we do the tales of Ulysses,Troy,Hercules and all the ancient gods, of times gone by, as nothing more than a collection of fables and not the final word of a God of death.

[Tomcat]

(tsadmirer @ Jul. 06 2007,20:42) I hope most of you will agree that war imposed on Iraq is senseless. No weapon of mass destructions are found.

hang on , Saddam admitted to having 40 tons of Anthrax .So do we take his word on this or not.he played a bad game of poker and lost. It hasnt been found but so what, maybe its hidden. The world is a big place.

The fucking idiot invaded Kuwait remember and he gassed the Kurds and...so on and on..
He started a war with Iran that killed a few million at least for no reason.... Still think hes a good guy...

[stogie bear]

He died with dignity, though. I respect him for that.

[stogie bear]

There are loads of countries where you can be a Muslim. The UK should not have been twisted into one of them. Go Australia... and Go Thailand... They make no bones about turning away the wack jobs and making the ones that sneak in very unwelcome.

[tsadmirer]

Hi Tomcat

I have little knowledge about history but would you please tell me who urge Saddam Hussain to go on war with Iran?? It was US who supported them during Iran - Iraq war. Does this make sense?

Nigel, thank you for a detailed reply and I respect your opinion about religion as it's one's own choice and personal matter. You are right in pointing out that a leader should stand by what he preaches. Our whole nation is sad and angry over these fuckin idiot brothers to bring a bad name to Islam. Thank God that Army has now entered the mosque and trying to capture this mentally ill human being who is preaching hatered in the name of religion.

I have read a quote somewhere and it is something I would like to share with you guys

"People argue for religion, fight for religion and most of the time die for religion. But, they never follow the religion."

Love you all.

[Road Runner]

(tsadmirer @ Jul. 10 2007,10:02) I have little knowledge about history but would you please tell me who urge Saddam Hussain to go on war with Iran?? It was US who supported them during Iran - Iraq war. Does this make sense?

Hello Tsadmirer,

I must admit I don't know for sure if Saddam went into the war against Iran of his own accord or he was urged by the US.
Personally I don't believe the US encouraged him to start it  -  but if anyone has better evidence than me I stand to be corrected.
Most of the evidence suggests that Saddam thought that Iran was weak and divided at this time and saw an opportunity to grab the Shatt al-Arab waterway which has been fought over by the predecessors of both states for a long time.

His mistake was that while Iran was weak it was still able to mobilize a much larger army than Iraq. The conflict became one of numbers of bodies pitted against better equipment. Pretty much what is now happening inside Iraq.

For sure once the war had started the various interests started supporting their own pet sides against the other. As usual the arms manufacturers made a good profit.

What always gets me with most so called leaders is that they seem quite happy to tell their people that it's their 'duty' to die for whatever alleged cause.
The same leaders seem to be remarkably reluctant to do the same themselves.
Maybe they should look the word 'leader' up in a dictionary.  

RR.

[daveduke007]

Well our Lizzie ( Her Majesty the Queen )  has gone and done it now

She's only given Salman Rushdie a Knighthood

Apparentely she now has "insulted"  Islam and will pay for it