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  • #31
    More grist for the mill, Lads. It seems that according to CERN, you know, those pointy headed, socialist geeks, global warming/climate change is more the result of the sun's activity than anything we're doing.
    Until I read this, I was a firm believer that climate change was the result of human actions, i.e., the of burning fossil fuels. Now, not so much.

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news....e-shock

    Sun Causes Climate Change Shock
    By James Delingpole


    If Michael Crichton had lived to write a follow-up to State of Fear, the plotline might well have gone like this: at a top secret, state of the art laboratory in Switzerland, scientists finally discover the true cause of "global warming". It's the sun, stupid. More specifically €“ as the Danish physicist Henrik Svensmark has long postulated €“ it's the result of cosmic rays which act as a seed for cloud formation. The scientists working on the project are naturally euphoric: this is a major breakthrough which will not only overturn decades of misguided conjecture on so-called Man Made Global Warming but will spare the global economy trillions of dollars which might otherwise have been squandered on utterly pointless efforts to reduce anthropogenic CO2 emissions. However, these scientists have failed to realise just how many people €“ alarmist scientists, huckster politicians, rent-seeking landowners like (the late Michael Crichton's brilliant and, of course, entirely fictional creation) the absurd, pompous Sir Reginald Leeds Bt, green activists, eco-fund managers, EU technocrats, MSM environmental correspondents €“ stand to gain from the Man Made "Climate Change" industry. Their discovery must be suppressed at all costs. So, one by one, the scientists on the cosmic ray project find themselves being bumped off, until only one man remains and must race against time to prove, etc, etc€¦
    Except of course in the real world the second part wouldn't happen. No one would need to go to the trouble of bumping off those pesky scientists with their awkward, annoying facts and their proper actual research. That's because the MSM and the scientific "community" would find it perfectly easy to suppress the story anyway, without recourse to severed brake cables or ricin-impregnated hand-washes or staged "suicides".
    This is exactly what has happened with the latest revelations from CERN over its landmark CLOUD experiment, whose significance Lawrence Solomon explains here:
    The science is now all-but-settled on global warming, convincing new evidence demonstrates, but Al Gore, the IPCC and other global warming doomsayers won€™t be celebrating. The new findings point to cosmic rays and the sun €” not human activities €” as the dominant controller of climate on Earth.
    The research, published with little fanfare this week in the prestigious journal Nature, comes from über-prestigious CERN, the European Organization for Nuclear Research, one of the world€™s largest centres for scientific research involving 60 countries and 8,000 scientists at more than 600 universities and national laboratories. CERN is the organization that invented the World Wide Web, that built the multi-billion dollar Large Hadron Collider, and that has now built a pristinely clean stainless steel chamber that precisely recreated the Earth€™s atmosphere.
    In this chamber, 63 CERN scientists from 17 European and American institutes have done what global warming doomsayers said could never be done €” demonstrate that cosmic rays promote the formation of molecules that in Earth€™s atmosphere can grow and seed clouds, the cloudier and thus cooler it will be. Because the sun€™s magnetic field controls how many cosmic rays reach Earth€™s atmosphere (the stronger the sun€™s magnetic field, the more it shields Earth from incoming cosmic rays from space), the sun determines the temperature on Earth.
    So if it's so great, why aren't we hearing more about it? Well, possibly because the Director General of CERN Rolf-Dieter Heuer would prefer it that way. Here's how he poured cold water on the results in an interview with Die Welt Online:
    I have asked the colleagues to present the results clearly, but not to interpret them. That would go immediately into the highly political arena of the climate change debate. One has to make clear that cosmic radiation is only one of many parameters.
    Nigel Calder, who has been following the CLOUD experiment for some time, was the first to smell a rat. He notes:
    CERN has joined a long line of lesser institutions obliged to remain politically correct about the man-made global warming hypothesis. It€™s OK to enter €œthe highly political arena of the climate change debate€ provided your results endorse man-made warming, but not if they support Svensmark€™s heresy that the Sun alters the climate by influencing the cosmic ray influx and cloud formation.
    and
    The once illustrious CERN laboratory ceases to be a truly scientific institute when its Director General forbids its physicists and visiting experimenters to draw the obvious scientific conclusions from their results
    Lubos Motl, too, detects some double standards here:
    One could perhaps understand if all scientists were similarly gagged and prevented from interpreting the results of their research in ways that could be relevant for policymaking. However, the main problem is that many people who are trying to work on very different phenomena in the climate are not prevented from interpreting €“ and indeed, overinterpreting and misinterpreting €“ their results that are often less serious, less reliable, and less rigorous, perhaps by orders of magnitude, than the observations by the European Organization for Nuclear Research.
    Moreover, this sentence by Heuer
    One has to make clear that cosmic radiation is only one of many parameters.is really a proof of his prejudice. Whether the cosmic radiation is just one player or the only relevant player or an important player or an unimportant player is something that this very research has been supposed to determine or help to determine. An official doesn't have the moral right to predetermine in advance what "one has to make clear" about these a priori unknown scientific results.
    But then, as Lawrence Solomon reminds us, this was never an experiment the scientific establishment wanted to happen in the first place.
    The hypothesis that cosmic rays and the sun hold the key to the global warming debate has been Enemy No. 1 to the global warming establishment ever since it was first proposed by two scientists from the Danish Space Research Institute, at a 1996 scientific conference in the U.K. Within one day, the chairman of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, Bert Bolin, denounced the theory, saying, €œI find the move from this pair scientifically extremely naive and irresponsible.€ He then set about discrediting the theory, any journalist that gave the theory cre dence, and most of all the Danes presenting the theory €” they soon found themselves vilified, marginalized and starved of funding, despite their impeccable scientific credentials.
    The mobilization to rally the press against the Danes worked brilliantly, with one notable exception. Nigel Calder, a former editor of The New Scientist who attended that 1996 conference, would not be cowed. Himself a physicist, Mr. Calder became convinced of the merits of the argument and a year later, following a lecture he gave at a CERN conference, so too did Jasper Kirkby, a CERN scientist in attendance. Mr. Kirkby then convinced the CERN bureaucracy of the theory€™s importance and developed a plan to create a cloud chamber €” he called it CLOUD, for €œCosmics Leaving OUtdoor Droplets.€
    But Mr. Kirkby made the same tactical error that the Danes had €” not realizing how politicized the global warming issue was, he candidly shared his views with the scientific community.
    €œThe theory will probably be able to account for somewhere between a half and the whole of the increase in the Earth€™s temperature that we have seen in the last century,€ Mr. Kirkby told the scientific press in 1998, explaining that global warming may be part of a natural cycle in the Earth€™s temperature.
    The global warming establishment sprang into action, pressured the Western governments that control CERN, and almost immediately succeeded in suspending CLOUD. It took Mr. Kirkby almost a decade of negotiation with his superiors, and who knows how many compromises and unspoken commitments, to convince the CERN bureaucracy to allow the project to proceed. And years more to create the cloud chamber and convincingly validate the Danes€™ groundbreaking theory.
    Still, as you'd expect, the BBC remains dutifully on-message. Read this report by its science correspondent Pallab Ghosh and you'll be left in little doubt that a) the latest results are dull beyond measure and b) that if they do mean anything at all, it's that global warming is still very much man-made. Here's their tame expert, Reading University's Dr Mike Lockwood, on hand to provide them the perfect pull-quote:
    Does this mean that cosmic rays can produce cloud? €“ No€
    PS Welcome to all you American readers brought here by Drudge. Please come again. And if you want to read more about how the environmental movement got so powerful, how the junk scientists got away with it for so long, and why so many people fell for the biggest most expensive scam in history, you might enjoy my new book on the subject €“ Watermelons: the Green Movement's True Colors. (Also available on Kindle)
    "Bankin' off of the northeast wind
    Salin' on a summer breeze
    And skippin' over the ocean, like a stone."
    -Harry Nilsson

    Comment


    • #32
      If it wasn't for planes flying and the resulting cloud formation from contrails the earth would warm up even more. Empirical evidence was when "all" planes where grounded after 911.

      Qantas announced in August that it had more than doubled annual profit to AU$250 million

      The bosses got HUGE pay increase, but no one else. You wonder why the guys & gals at the pointy end got pissed off.

      This "lock out" is ridiculous!!!

      Comment


      • #33
        Virgin Blue to be new national airline? Qantas doomed probably. What a mess.
        TT

        Comment


        • #34
          I dont normally agree with Tourout but he is correct. Welcome to my life. Shared sacrifice, shared rewards. Our company almost went tits up after 9-11. Employees took HUGE (35-40%) pay cuts at the same time management STILL got bonuses. That was when we were bleeding money. Now, we are profiting, they still wont even give us a little raise. Fuck em I wish we could do the same thing. If we burn it down, we burn it down. I can only take so much. In this case, I would rather live one day like a lion than my enitre life like a lamb........
          Be careful out there!

          Comment


          • #35
            We will all be working for 3rd world wages if these x@#$% get away with this!!

            Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce should resign immediately. He's only on AUD5Mil!!

            Qantas Airways and its unions appeared before a labour tribunal on Sunday with Australia's prime minister urging an end to the industrial dispute that grounded the airline's fleet, stranding tens of thousands of passengers.

            Qantas said it had cancelled 447 flights affecting more than 68,000 passengers since grounding over 100 aircraft around the world on Saturday.

            Jetstar, Jetconnect - which includes trans-Tasman flights - and QantasLink flights are not affected by the grounding and continue to operate as normal.

            The airline is seeking to bring to a head a prolonged and increasingly bitter battle with its unions over pay, working conditions and plans to set up two new airlines in Asia.

            Qantas plans to cut 1,000 jobs and order $11 billion of new Airbus aircraft as part of a makeover to salvage its loss-making international business.

            The abrupt escalation in the dispute angered the government and came as an embarrassment for Prime Minister Julia Gillard, who was hosting a summit of Commonwealth leaders in the western city of Perth, 17 of them booked to fly out on Sunday with Qantas.

            "There is no case for this radical overreaction," Assistant Treasurer and former senior union official Bill Shorten told the Australia Broadcasting Corp.

            "Sixty-eight thousand Australians and the tourism industry has been grossly inconvenienced by this high-handed ambush of the passenger."

            Gillard, criticised for not intervening earlier in the dispute, said the tribunal hearing in Melbourne was needed to quickly resolve the impasse.

            "We took this action because we were concerned about the damage to the economy," she told reporters in Perth.

            "The government is arguing for an end to the industrial action," she said, adding that most leaders had made alternate flight plans.

            BOLD, UNBELIEVABLE DECISION

            Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce estimated the "bold decision, an unbelievable decision" to lock out workers and ground the fleet would cost the company A$20 million (NZ$26.1 million) a day.

            He said the special labor tribunal, which reconvened after a late-night meeting on Saturday, would have to terminate all industrial action before the airline could resume flying.

            "We're hoping a determination is made today and that will give us certainty about what we can do and start planning to get the airline back in the air," Joyce told Australia's Sky News.

            He indicated Qantas could be flying again on Monday if the Fair Work Australia tribunal ordered the termination of industrial action on Sunday.

            Qantas and the unions would then have 21 days to negotiate a settlement before binding arbitration would be imposed.

            The lockout is the latest in a rising tide of industrial unrest in Australia as unions increase pressure for a greater share of profits amid tight labor markets and a boom in resource prices.

            It threatens to become the most significant disruption to Australian aviation since a dispute in 1989 that lasted for six months and had a significant impact on tourism and other business. Industrial action by engineers cost Qantas around A$130 million (NZ$169.6 million) in 2008.

            Qantas faced angry shareholders and workers at a shareholders' meeting on Friday when the company said the labor dispute since September had caused a dive in forward bookings and was costing it A$15 million (NZ$19.6 million) a week.

            The shareholders backed hefty pay rises to senior Qantas executives, including a A$5 million (NZ$6.5 million) package for Joyce.

            The action sparked an angry response from Australia's Transport Minister Anthony Albanese on Saturday.

            "I'm extremely disappointed. What's more, I indicated very clearly to Mr Joyce that I was disturbed by the fact that we've had a number of discussions and at no stage has Mr Joyce indicated to me that this was an action under consideration," he said.

            Tony Sheldon of the Transport Workers Union said the lockout was cynical and pre-planned.

            "It's a company strategy that shareholders should have been told about, that the Australian community should have been told about, not ambushed in the dead of night," he said.

            The Australian and International Pilots Association (AIPA) was flabbergasted at the move to ground the fleet, describing it as "brinkmanship in the extreme".

            "Alan Joyce is holding a knife to the nation's throat," said Richard Woodward, vice-president of AIPA.

            MASSIVE DISRUPTIONS

            Qantas check-in desks across Australia were empty on Sunday morning as customers scrambled for alternative travel arrangements. The airline usually flies more than 60,000 people a day.

            Australian rival Virgin Blue said it was adding an extra 3,000 seats on its domestic network on Sunday to assist Qantas passengers.

            Qantas's decision left many passengers venting their anger after they were stranded in 22 cities around the globe.

            "To resolve this at the expense of paying customers on one of the biggest flying days in Australia is quite frankly ... bizarre, unwarranted and unfair to the loyal customers that Australia has," a businessman, who gave his name only as Barry, told Sky TV at Melbourne airport.

            This weekend is one of Australia's busiest for travel, with tens of thousands traveling to the hugely popular Melbourne Cup horse race on Tuesday, dubbed "the race that stops the nation".

            Shares in the airline have fallen almost 40 percent this year, underperforming the 8 percent fall in the benchmark index.

            Comment


            • #36
              (strocube @ Oct. 30 2011,07:19) . It seems that according to CERN,
              With all respect i think this article is just a spin on the CERN results which were already know anyway. I am an avid reader of the Telegraph but on this issue they are usually biased to placate the right wingers that  read it
              and want to hear this news to re enforce there own delusions ( of course this does not include ne:laugh: )

              Most of the hardened critics inlcuding Bjorn Lomberg , whom i admire, actually changed their opinons a long time ago. The main issue is that these thing happen over hundreds of years and maybe not our lifetime and so it very complex.

              I think its to early to extrapolate anything from CERN but if in the longer term it adds to the debate then all for the good...but i think this reporter has stretched the facts.

              Comment


              • #37
                Thanks, Tomcat. That's good to know.
                Since I've pretty much sworn off politics, I have little or no idea about the situation from the other side of the pond.
                Cheers
                "Bankin' off of the northeast wind
                Salin' on a summer breeze
                And skippin' over the ocean, like a stone."
                -Harry Nilsson

                Comment


                • #38
                  .One of the best arbiters of Knowledge in the field come from Scientific American Magazine which i never miss and in fact did have some articles this month refering to this very subject. Completely un biased as well.

                  Once my jet lag wears off ill read the CERN article again

                  I think Govts are so desperate for $$$ that any excuse to fill there coffers will do. The tax alone on my flight London- BKK- Hong Kong was $650.(US). That tax money goes back into subsidies for solar panels in the UK which are useless as the place is cloudy and grim most of the time , especially up North where its raining 50 % of the time as well . and the payback is 50 years or never as after 5 years the panel is out of date and useless.

                  Spend £20,000 on Solar panels in Uk to run a set of Xmas lights once a year. So many people have been conned by this its unbelievable.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Coincidently

                    Solar power boom 'unsustainable', says Gov
                    Massive payouts to rooftop panel owners to be slashed
                    By Andrew Orlowski €¢ Posted in Small Biz, 31st October 2011 11:47 GMT
                    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/10...veryone_panic/

                    The comments to the article are interesting.
                    including

                    Stats about FIT installations can be found from:

                    https://www.renewablesandchp.ofgem.gov.uk/Public....egory=0

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Cant open them Stats ??.

                      From what i understand most of the current solar panels that are used in installations are pretty much useless and the efficiency of the next generation panels will be better for Northern Europe climates.

                      Of course you will always be behind as the technology moves fast but i think everyone has been conned with the current porducts and i wouldnt waste a cent

                      Even in California a big solar Company bit the dust recently i was reading in the Economist on the plane home and them guys have all the sunshine they need... cant remember what the problem was there

                      IMO much future energy will be grown in giant Algae Ponds where they use photosynthesis to generate sugars etc etc to produce energy... copy the plants in other words.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        They open for me in Firefox 10. Did you scroll right far enough to the view link??

                        There are many other useful links in the article (Register) comments

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Thanks for that

                          In the scheme of things i think the Ozzies will still fair pretty good in the coming years due to the mineral wealth that thye have

                          Also i see a US Army Geologist report  that was published without much publicity recently and one can expect Afghanistan to start climbing the wealth league in the next ten years. The mineral wealth there is staggering .Just one rare earth mineral alone they think could be worth 1 Trillion USD.

                          Theres Gold in them thar hills

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            AIIA takes the €˜Australian€™ out of price-gouge concerns

                            * http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/07..._to_be_joking/

                            Sock-puppetting the case for higher prices

                            By Richard Chirgwin €¢ Posted in Business, 30th July 2012 23:45 GMT

                            As predicted by The Register, once the IT and related industries lumbered into motion to respond to the Australian Parliament€™s inquiry into IT pricing in Australia, the rent-seeking would begin.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Australia, we will miss you.
                              TEXASMAC

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Azza when you first started this thread, i can say the exact same thing about here in Ireland, but in our case, we got gobshites in europe tell our little pricks some people call a government to keep hurting the poor and middle classes, but they do fuck all about multi-national companies and stinking rich, who have been taking money out of economy and sending it abroad.


                                I feel very soon i will be saying RIP and get fucked Ireland.
                                i love t-girls

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