Don't waste money on "long-time!"

[thaibound]

Had an unfortunate first experience last night in bkk with the lovely little Fern of Guess Bar, when she ruined a beautiful evening by asking to bail from our overnight date at midnight and then keeping the full amount we'd agreed upon. I'm not going to tussle over a 1000baht note, but i told her i'd have to speak up about such an unprofessional attitude. She clearly preferred the 1000baht now, to a busy future. So here's how it went.

The thread "monkeyman in the studio" has some beauties i just "had" to see. First among them was Alis of Cascades. On Wednesday night we had a pre-arranged "long-time" overnight that went so well, I made arrangements to do the same thing again last night with Fern, whose hot photos are on the same thread and who works at the new and fabulous Guess Bar.

The dates were very similar in many ways. Both began with the girls coming to me at the dynasty grande and immediately hitting my room to relieve the day's tensions. In both cases, jobs well-done.  Afterward we headed out for drinks and dinner.

On Wednesday with Alis we hooked up with Katooeylover who was with Anna of Obsession and after drinks at Guess with Donny and Mint,  four of us had an excellent thai meal at an outdoor cafe, back to the Guess for drinks, then after a three-taxi adventure, Alis and I retired to my room for round two, after which we showered and hit the sack.

On Friday with Fern it was much the same. After our initial mutual satisfaction, we strolled the *very* short distance up soi 6 and cut over to soi 8 to the Soi 8 Bar for drinks, dinner and pool. Monkeyman and Socrates 999 joined us for the drinks and pool and all can attest that Fern was looking awesome. Far and away the hottest girl of any sort in the bar. Shooting pool in high heels and cut-offs it was all i could do when she ground herself in my lap to think about pool. It was an excellent evening, after which she and I headed back to the hotel for a fine round two.

Both Alis and Fern, btw, look just as good - if not better - up close and personal than they do in the photos - and if you've seen the photos you know just how good that is! lol

But whereas the post-round 2 shower with alis led to bed and a sleep so deep that the next thing i knew it was 11am and when she asked if she could go back to her room i just smiled, got a kiss and watched her go. Lovely.

With Fern, however, the post-round 2 shower found her sitting up in bed, just getting off the phone -- again! -- and asking if she could go to her room. It was barely midnight. All the bars still open and busy on a friday night. We'd arranged very clearly an overnight "long-time" with the specific mention of "fuck you in the morning, ok?". And now, out of nowhere, she wanted to go.

Now, if a girl wants to go, she wants to go and i'm not about to discourage her happiness, so i say fine, but...since you're not staying, what should i give you?
"Money" she replies.
"Yes, but how much?"
I have the three 1000 baht notes in my hand which we had agreed to previously and I held them out to see if she would take the two I thought she should take. She took all three.
"Why do I pay all three, if you do not stay?" I ask.
She has no satisfactory answer. She puts the bills into her purse. I say, I will not argue with her, but if she takes money she does not earn then I will have to tell my friends what she does.
She does not care.
"You are angry?" she asks.
"Yes," I say. "You take money you did not earn. You promised to stay all night. Now you leave, so I should pay you less."
She shrugs, stands to go.
"Okay, see you at bar." I say.

The internet in the room was down so I couldn't post immediately and I certainly couldn't sleep, so I sms'd monkeyman to see if he was still at the bar. He was. So i headed over to commiserate -- and to tell jay what had happened. Which i did.

Jay was very disappointed to hear what I told her. She apologized and I think was about to offer to refund my money, but I stopped her. I said I do not want the money back. If i was that concerned i'm sure i could have prevented fern from taking it. My concern was that the girl would clearly promise to stay all night, then take a call from someone - maybe a customer, but probably her boyfriend - and then just leave. Jay agreed. I had a drink, whined a bit and as the bar had to close, i headed out. Coco stopped me at the door to tell me if i wanted any of the other girls from the bar, i could have them. Because that's clearly *anyone's* option, lol, i think she must have meant "no barfine".

So the staff was very supportive and I think perhaps they will *again* make it clear to the girls that their service reflects on the bar's service, but until i've seen that proven, i'd recommend short-time only. And with fern, i would *definitely* stay away from any long-time -- no matter how cute and excited she might appear to be asked on long-tiime. Fact is, when i asked her the night before to come stay with me the next night, she jumped around like a giddy schoolgirl at my having chosen her.

So much for anticipation.

Bottom line, if you like to cuddle with a beautiful ladyboy and awaken with her for a morning bout of pleasure, little fern is *not* the one to choose.

Good hunting.

[jhcal26]

Thanks for the intel. I guess not everything associated with Guess is gold. How was Alis? She's definately a stunner that I wish I BF'ed. Definately on my list for next time if she doesn't remember me (I promised to BF her and ended up going w/ someone else). She was not pleased.

[Stewart]

I guess not everything associated with Guess is gold.  

Personally, I think it is a bit unfair on Guess Bar to make that link that the girls performance is the bar's fault (although it is natural to make the link)

GB has done its job of providing us a location, a nice atmosphere, and a range of girls for us to choose from. We pay for our drinks and the barfine - transaction complete with the bar.

There are then 100 reasons why a particular experience between girl and customer can go well, or not so well. You cannot possibly say it was the bar's fault if it did not go well.......or indeed give the bar all the credit if it went really well. What is Jay going to do......fire a girl for every one of those 100 reasons?

If you were paying the bar the 3000, then the bar could be responsible. But you are not...2 separate transactions

[thaibound]

not surprisingly, the girls are no less disappointed when we fail to keep our promises than we are when they fail to keep theirs.

if you want a ladyboy who does not dress in the typical style -- the "joke" in thailand is you can recognize a ladyboy because she's dressed the hottest with the most stylish hair and m.u. -- but alis wore baggy cargo pants and sneakers and even said she's been described as a "tom" (meaning "tomboy"), but i found it totally femme and hot and unique (just ask simon who was sitting with Alis's good friend at cascades, the beautiful Pi, decked out in tight white skirt and heels and looking totally edible, but all he could do was talk about *my* date, Alis, lol), so if you like that, i highly recommend alis. *very* limited english, but she loves to learn.

i recommend you book her the day before and *keep* your promise! then treat her right and she will more than keep hers...; )

[janabiyah]

Hi Thaibound, sorry to hear about your experience, I think it frequently happens that gurls will try to turn a LT into a ST and still get fully paid.

You shouldnt feel badly about reducing her fee if she leaves early.

You have made your complaint to the Guess bar and I guess the outcome you are seeking is that we should be aware that Fern may slip away early if we barfine her LT?

So thanks for the heads up.

Hope it doesnt affect the rest of your holiday

[jhcal26]

(Stewart @ Jan. 06 2007,14:42)

I guess not everything associated with Guess is gold.

Personally, I think it is a bit unfair on Guess Bar to make that link that the girls performance is the bar's fault (although it is natural to make the link)

GB has done its job of providing us a location, a nice atmosphere, and a range of girls for us to choose from. We pay for our drinks and the barfine - transaction complete with the bar.

There are then 100 reasons why a particular experience between girl and customer can go well, or not so well. You cannot possibly say it was the bar's fault if it did not go well.......or indeed give the bar all the credit if it went really well. What is Jay going to do......fire a girl for every one of those 100 reasons?

If you were paying the bar the 3000, then the bar could be responsible. But you are not...2 separate transactions

As long as it works both ways then I agree.

[mardhi]

Come to think of it, Fern was one of the girls who did not go to the disco after the bar closed on New Years Eve - I don't recall if it was because she was barfined or if she chose to go home, however I suspect it was the latter as I know she has a Thai boyfriend as Jay told me thats why she is so shy and holds back in the bar.     He (the Thai BF) is probably struggling himself with the whole issue and as she is new into this game (what been working in a bar for just a  couple of weeks) - you were probably her first time for an overnight and he hit the roof with her on the phone once he found out her plan was not to come home that night.    I think you made the right choice - odd's are she would not have been the same had she stayed and the morning performance for her at least would have been clouded in guilt.    

On the upside though, sounds like Jay handled it properly and will no doubt have a chat with Fern and suggest that she is more open with what she is able to do and not able to do - of course Thai BF's are not uncommon - but she needs to be more honest with what she can do and not do and not mislead someone into thinking something is available when in all honesty its not - again thats another Thai trait, where they tell you what you want to hear, not what they are able to deliver.  

Cheers
Mardhi

[stogie bear]

Although your experience is frustrating, it's not unusual for this to happen. In fact I have trained myself to half expect it. But, like has been mentioned already, the reasons could be one of a multitude.

I'm sure she'll very quickly learn that this is bad poloicy when a bunch of guys talk to her about this at the bar in the next few days (and I am pretty certain that they will!)

[koykaeng]

Hi Thaibound,

Certainly a number of ladyboys have Thai boyfriends or other reasons which prevent them from staying Long Time, however providing its made clear before they are barfined its not an issue, as both parties are clear on the matter.

From the way you described things, Fern wasn't upfront & honest with you about having to leave early, and then made matters worse by helping herself to the full 3000 Baht on offer.

With regards to Guess Bar's response to the incident, I can guarantee you that no other LB bar in Nana Plaza or elsewhere would have dealt with it in such a professional manner.

Anyway, if thats the worst thing that happens to you, life's pretty good, but nevertheless I think you do make a valid point.

Cheers
Koykaeng

[thaibound]

(mardhi @ Jan. 06 2007,01:00) Come to think of it, Fern was one of the girls who did not go to the disco after the bar closed on New Years Eve - I don't recall if it was because she was barfined or if she chose to go home, however I suspect it was the latter as I know she has a Thai boyfriend as Jay told me thats why she is so shy and holds back in the bar.     He (the Thai BF) is probably struggling himself with the whole issue and as she is new into this game (what been working in a bar for just a  couple of weeks) - you were probably her first time for an overnight and he hit the roof with her on the phone once he found out her plan was not to come home that night.    I think you made the right choice - odd's are she would not have been the same had she stayed and the morning performance for her at least would have been clouded in guilt.    

On the upside though, sounds like Jay handled it properly and will no doubt have a chat with Fern and suggest that she is more open with what she is able to do and not able to do - of course Thai BF's are not uncommon - but she needs to be more honest with what she can do and not do and not mislead someone into thinking something is available when in all honesty its not - again thats another Thai trait, where they tell you what you want to hear, not what they are able to deliver.  

Cheers
Mardhi

mardhi, i think we are in total accord here. jay is, i believe, handling it just as i had hoped, by explaining to fern that she must not promise what she will not deliver. the reason for my post (besides to vent a bit, lol) was to be sure my compatriots don't get misled in the meantime - or in case jay's lesson fails.

the whole "thai truth" thing remains problematic, but something as clearcut as promising to stay and then leaving without warning i believe contradicts even that foggy ethic.

i do wish i had known more about fern's situation beforehand, in which case i probably would not have arranged for an overnight, and our shorttime "evening" together would have been damn near perfect. yet another reason to share with one another as much as possible -- without betraying any intimacies or confidences. knowing a girl's proclivities with regard to shorttime vs longtiime can be *especially* helpful in maximizing one's time and money and minimizing disappointment.

i hope this thread is seen in that light -- as it was intended. an accidental TOFTT if ever there was one about a cute good-for-ST girl from an excellent bar.

[allstar88]

(stogie bear @ Jan. 06 2007,16:14) Although your experience is frustrating, it's not unusual for this to happen. In fact I have trained myself to half expect it. But, like has been mentioned already, the reasons could be one of a multitude.

I'm sure she'll very quickly learn that this is bad poloicy when a bunch of guys talk to her about this at the bar in the next few days (and I am pretty certain that they will!)

been there,got the shirt too   thats life        

[mardhi]

(thaibound @ Jan. 06 2007,15:24)

(mardhi @ Jan. 06 2007,01:00) Come to think of it, Fern was one of the girls who did not go to the disco after the bar closed on New Years Eve - I don't recall if it was because she was barfined or if she chose to go home, however I suspect it was the latter as I know she has a Thai boyfriend as Jay told me thats why she is so shy and holds back in the bar.     He (the Thai BF) is probably struggling himself with the whole issue and as she is new into this game (what been working in a bar for just a  couple of weeks) - you were probably her first time for an overnight and he hit the roof with her on the phone once he found out her plan was not to come home that night.    I think you made the right choice - odd's are she would not have been the same had she stayed and the morning performance for her at least would have been clouded in guilt.    

On the upside though, sounds like Jay handled it properly and will no doubt have a chat with Fern and suggest that she is more open with what she is able to do and not able to do - of course Thai BF's are not uncommon - but she needs to be more honest with what she can do and not do and not mislead someone into thinking something is available when in all honesty its not - again thats another Thai trait, where they tell you what you want to hear, not what they are able to deliver.  

Cheers
Mardhi

mardhi, i think we are in total accord here. jay is, i believe, handling it just as i had hoped, by explaining to fern that she must not promise what she will not deliver.  the reason for my post (besides to vent a bit, lol) was to be sure my compatriots don't get misled in the meantime - or in case jay's lesson fails.

the whole "thai truth" thing remains problematic, but something as clearcut as promising to stay and then leaving without warning i believe contradicts even that foggy ethic.

i do wish i had known more about fern's situation beforehand, in which case i probably would not have arranged for an overnight, and our shorttime "evening" together would have been damn near perfect.  yet another reason to share with one another as much as possible -- without betraying any intimacies or confidences. knowing a girl's proclivities with regard to shorttime vs longtiime can be *especially* helpful in maximizing one's time and money and minimizing disappointment.

i hope this thread is seen in that light -- as it was intended. an accidental TOFTT if ever there was one about a cute good-for-ST girl from an excellent bar.  

I would suspect that she had every intention of staying with you the whole night and was probably looking forward to it. No doubt the only thing was that she had 'overlooked' telling her BF that this was her intention. This was probably fueled by her knowledge that maybe her BF (who works in a gay boy bar) stays overnight with customers and she 'assumed' it would be no different for her. She probably had a rude awakening when he said, well no actually as a Thai man I do have double standards - you do as I say, not what do what I do. Hence she probably felt obligated to go home to him. Just sounds to me that you were in the difficult situation of being the guy who wanted to get his end away in the morning and stuck in the middle of a tif between them. Hopefully the lesson will be learnt and you can assume that the following will likely happen:

1. Fern no longer even attempts to go LT
2. Her BF accepts it going forward (and there are loads that do)
3. He says he is not comfortable with her working in a bar and she leaves.

Again, I dont know any of this as fact, just guessing what is likely to have happended - incidentally I dont of any other girls who have BF's in Guess bar but I would not be surprised if others do - for sure Jane does not but thats the only one I know for sure.

Ironically I believe Fern must have liked you a lot - she is normally very shy and I have never seen her approach a guy hence I asked Jay why is she so restrained and thus found out the answer that a) she is new to working in a bar and b) has a Thai BF she loves and is in the feel guilty stage (despite him doing whatever he wants by the sound of things).

Cheers
Mardhi

[simon_125]

Sorry you had that experience thaibound. The first night on my first trip to Bkk i had the same experience with Layla from obsessions. Paid her long time and at 1 am she tells me she has to leave as she has to be up early for school. Like you we arranged a long time for 3k that ment staying till the morning. I later found out about her thai boyfriend who insists she is home by 3 am.
For me now i say to the girls i take long time if they leave before 6 am then I only give them short time money.
Alis I so love Alis. I love to watch her dance in cascade, she has such great control of her body. When i saw her outside the bar in a vest and cargo pants she reminded me of some of the beautiful female students we get in the uk, the ones who never slap on the make up or get dress up but still look amazing! I'm gutted I never got to take her, she is top of my list for next time.
When you send me a message saying we could swap for a couple of hours I so wanted to but I don't think my sister would of been too happy

[Guest]

Thaibound

I am not sure i would have given her the 3000 but each reacts differntly in cases like this.

I had reverse happen to me i was acousted by beer on my last trip i paid 2000 for overnight. But i had over done the beer and as monkey called them snicks chick drinks my sugar played up and i had to kick the poor girl out she was a bit pissed and had to call her b/f for a lift.

but previous to this i did dble where the two girls tried tp ripe me off as i was newby i stood firm and paid what the threads here suggested was a fair price.

At the end of the as sb says he is prepared for it and i say it is the nature of the beast that will happen and does.
Guess bar for sure has nothing to worry about except mabe a shy girl will get a bit less work for a while.

i think 1000 good compliments and 1 bad one(not bars fault) is damm good batting average.

[buttafly]

This story is more common than you think

seems like some guys have mentioned here that most of these ladyboys have Thai boyfriends [or at least want one over us 40-something westerners] and in the end they go home to them or out looking for Thai guys in their spare time.

remmeber a key phrase that has never ever changed; Ladyboys will always take the better offer no matter what