Nana Plaza has got five years left, tops...

[Guest]

I take this thread seriously and am very concerned as to where I would need to hang my hat in the near future. As I have access to satellite eavesdropping I have aimed my dish at the UdunThani Senate Session of 2/5/08. Here is what transpired (not in its entirety).

Meeting called to order by Village Chiefs. I welcome all of you from all over Isaan to the first annual LB and GG Prostitute Relocation Convention. MakMak from the village of Wherethefuckthani has been reading the ATS Forum and tells us of the impending need for relocation of all Prossies in the very near future.

[Guest]

If each of the village chiefs can donate at leat 4 Rai of land that will give us the equivalent of a parcel the size of the current EuroDisney land. We can then build TransWorld and ProssieWorld and corner the market on all prostitution for Isaan. Our boys and girls never have to leave Isaan again. We will have hotels, restaurants, theme parks (FemBoy world for Mirimark and others) (Amazon World of large dick LB's), KarmagraWorld for those so inclined, and ad infinitum. The farang will fly directly in to Udon Thani Airbase and never have ti inhale that BigSmoke again. A healthy farang is a wealthy farang. And a wealthy farang leads to a wealthy Isaan for all!!

[stogie bear]

Fascinating thread and it makes me proud to be a member of this forum that it was conducted in such a fine manner.

[pacman]

Spot on SB.
This has been a very well conducted thread.
God knows I tried my best, felt like I had enough until doug arrived to carry on the argument, & rolled out a ton of info.
I enjoyed reading the cut & thrust between doug & jadeite.
Without having to get abusive, there was a wealth of material & opinion thrown about.
I have always preferred the non-aggresive debates, either reading or partaking, & this on-line discussion was a beauty.
All the guest roles, you can see who they are, added to the debate, raising this thread to a standard other forums can only dream about.

I would like to share a drink with jadeite, perhaps you can tell us a little of yourself. Ethnicity, what brings you to LOS, anything else?

And doug, good job sir, but what the hell did you ever do to get under the skin of Naang Faa? It must be a good story.

Cheers . . . pacman.

[Road Runner]

Has anyone made it down to Patpong 2 to check out this new ladyboy venue?

RR.

[rxpharm]

ahh, now we need some volunteers to check that out! I get the feeling jadeite may be there soon and hopefully give us a report!

The expedition to Soi Cowboy refuted the claims that several 10's of lbs were working there.

Aperry, you forgot to put in postop lovers world before you put in the ad infinitum!

[jonstroud]

It all comes down to money. If the owner of a property can get more money from someone wanting to turn a bar into a shoe shop, then a shoe shop is what that property will be. That's why some of the bars in Patpong became souvenir shops. It's also why that awful street market persists despite the fire hazards. The Patpong family probably make more money from the market than they do from most of the bars they lease out.

Bangkok will go the way of Hong Kong and South Korea: they used to be sex tourist destinations but priced themseleves out of the market when their economies developed. The process is much, much slower in Thailand because the country's economy will never emulate Korea's, but prices are already rising and I'm sure some tourists are looking elsewhere. The $100 short time has arrived (admittedly, not everyone charges that much, but more will over the next few months).

Leases are usually respected, but not always. It depends on who's doing the disputing. Most of the problems arise when people start sub-leasing. This is what happened in Soi 10. It wasn't the tenants' fault. They all signed leases and paid their rents etc. Unfortunately for them, the leases were invalid because the leasor did not have the rights to the property.

All this is detracting from the important issue: where's that new LB bar in Patpong 2 and what's it like?

[Guest]

Yeah prices are going up but tourist are still coming in like hell because there are no other alternatives to Thailand. The best example what can go wrong if you close down bars and try to get rid of sex tourists are the Philippines with infamous Manila where nobody want to go anymore.The Thai economy is depending on the sex business as tourists will stay away if there are no more places like Nana. Do not forget that all these lovely creatures working there are supporting their families and keep the Thai economy going.Do not forget that Thailand still has a lot of poverty especially in Northern Thailand where farming is the name of the game.

[Guest]

Nana street has a lot of upscale places going up from Sukhumvit to the tobacco monopoly.

It's only time until the owner of the land can make more money from selling to a condo developer than from renting to and skimming off bars.

This has nothing to do with anything else, whatsoever. All these other arguments are bogus.

[Rollo Tomasi]

Everything in this thread is absolute speculation...

Some of it pretty good and some of it just plain bizarre!

I'm guessing that Cowboy will shut down long before Nana does.

[Snick]

(Rollo Tomasi @ Mar. 08 2008,10:41) Everything in this thread is absolute speculation...

Some of it pretty good and some of it just plain bizarre!

I'm guessing that Cowboy will shut down long before Nana does.

LOL, you say everything is speculation, and then you say 'I guess...'

Have you been to cowboy lately ?, ALL the bars are being upgraded. Lots of money is going into cowboy. People do not invest millions of dollars unless they know they will make a good return from it, and will be there long enough to make profit.

I'd be more worried about Nana since there is less sign of investment, and even a few vacancies.

p.s. by million I am speaking in aggregate, the 'average' update is about $100,000 usd

[stogie bear]

Have you seen the state of the escalator recently?

The thick rubber carrier grips are lying up and down the stairs and it's now actually fenced off so you can't even use it as a stairwell!

[rossco]

Nana is prime real estate. All the arguments re Thailand needing the "sex tourist" are not rational.

The Thai Government makes "Zip" out of this industry. It is a cash business with no formal salaries paid and I doubt the "Corporate Tax" is paid by the "Businesses". I posted earlier tat from the seminar I attended the emphasis for Tourism was on "Resorts" - up market venues owned by corporations who will pay corporation tax and all the employees will be salaried and also pay tax. This is how the Government will fill their treasure chest.

So they let it implode - so there are numerous more "workers" out of work. So what! There is no social care/unemployment benefit for the Government to pay. Just more people to harvest the rice!

Currently (from the Thai Military Bank) agriculture is now only 10% of GDP. I was surprised at this figure and would like to have also been informed of "what percentage of the population are employed directly/indirectly within Agriculture". I would bet that the percent of Thais in agriculture does not correlate to the GDP percentage.

It is easy to argue, from a Western perspective, that this is short sighted but for a nation that has never had social welfare/medicare plans to support unemployment is not an issue - for now.

My "speculation" is that the day the value of Nana & Soi Cowboy, real estate, outweighs the rental income/return, the owners currently receive, they will sell out.

The real question is not, will it happen, it is more a case of when and that is a Guess.

No matter how we feel about it all personally "sex tourism" will decline OR reinvent itself.

Maybe quasi legalised upmarket venues (paying tax of course). Society has always demanded a P4P scene - it is just how much are we prepared to pay in the future.

[Guest]

(Road Runner @ Mar. 04 2008,22:25) Has anyone made it down to Patpong 2 to check out this new ladyboy venue?

Can I volunteer?  Thank you to jadeite for the info.

[Road Runner]

(rossco @ Mar. 08 2008,04:16) Currently (from the Thai Military Bank) agriculture is now only 10% of GDP. I was surprised at this figure and would like to have also been informed of "what percentage of the population are employed directly/indirectly within Agriculture". I would bet that the percent of Thais in agriculture does not correlate to the GDP percentage.

Hello Rossco,

From what I have seen upcountry I have no doubt you are right.

I suspect that the 10% comes from the large farming companies and a few marginal taxes on industries connected with farming  -  chemicals, agricultural suppliers etc.

My guess is that probably 30-40% of the population is in farming or connected with.  But most of that farming is subsistence level so they are not paying taxes anyway.

RR.