Health Insurance

[moe666]

There are 2 kinds of health coverage avaliable in Thailand; Bupa for people staying short term and AIG for long stay.
 Email me and I will send you my friends cell phone number, her brother is a insurance broker and handles both coverages.
 You may have to leave a message with Kae if you call during the day, she is a teacher at an international school.
 The cost is very reasonable for the amount of coverage.

[stogie bear]

I know of over 20 insurance companies in Thailand and 5 that do general insurance (i.e. health) exclusively. These companies are BUPA, LMG, AXA, NZI-IAG and Thai Health Insurance (THI). There are also many health insurance companies outside of Thailand that cater to expats and visitors but they tend to be a tad more expensive though.

Most of the other life insurance companies will also offer health insurance as a 'rider.'

moe666 - you suggest that BUPA don't do long term insurance. This isn't the case.  You are correct that there are two types of insurance in Thailnd... but they are 'General' and 'Health.' (General often can include health!)

A popular company is an American company, American International Group, Inc. (AIG), that offers specific policies for most countries including Thailand. But it gets a bit complicated here... They operate under a company called AIU, (Americany International Underwriters.) They in turn have agents that call themsleves all kinds of things from New Hampshire Insurance Company to Universal Insurance Company Limited.

Both of these are members of the AIG company and work out of the same office in Bangkok.

Generally speaking, health insurance is paid promptly and in full (if all the forms are filled out correctly) by the major companies supplying health insurance from Thailand to long term residents. If you are a visitor then all this is probably covered by either your travel insurance or your family coverage back home so you won't even need it.

But iof course, this being Thailand, you will hear a lot of horror stories about people dying waiting for payments etc, both from competing insurance reps and from friends of friends, etc...

For long stays there are two points worth covering. Firstly, a great advantage of the health card is that it works like a credit card. When you check out of a hospital, you simply present your card to the billing department and you leave the hospital to fight the insurance company over the claim. There€™s no complicated messing about paying the bill from your own pocket and then trying to get your money back later.

The second important point about premium costs is the difference between an insurance policy that covers out-patient treatment and a policy that doesn€™t. You will find with all insurance companies that the premium nigh on doubles if you want out-patient cover and that you are covered for something like 20 out-patient visits per year.

This being Thailand the definition of being €˜admitted to hospital€™ may very from hospital to hospital. Thai Health Insurance considers anything over six hours as €˜patient being admitted€™. Contrary to belief, you do not need to stay in hospital overnight to be classed as an in-patient.

By the way - if you ARE counting your shekels (and you should be) then it's worth knowing that the costs for a consultation at a hospital varies from Doctor to Doctor... This makes pricing pretty complicated and frustrating to explain to a poor sick farang who got charged one thing from the new Doc straight out of school and the older more experienced Doc who has been around for years and feels he's worth more!

And the Doctors can pass off patients from one to the other, too! So you'll never make sense of your bill anyway!

These are just some general thoughts on this subject after years of different types of insurance both company and individual... Personally I would go with a 'Wealthy Healthy' plan and be covered for the nicer hotels, errr, I meant hospitals!  

[Ladyboy_Loser!]

Great information S.B. That is one of the things that I made damn sure I had taken care. Whether I am in Thailand or back in the U.S. for work I don't want to worry about a medical issue. If I'm broken I want to be fixed and damn the costs to the insurance companys. Of course I am looking forward to the first time I have to stay in one of the "better" hospitals in Thailand. Private room, choice of foods(Thai, Japanese, Chinese, Farang) gorgeous nurses, top flight care and no expenses for me. Hell, I wanna get sick right now.

[stogie bear]

Hell, I wanna get sick right now.

You certainly do and I don't blame you. Anyone fresh to this so called 'third world' country will get a shock when they see the opulent care, coverage and facilities by these fantastic hospitals.

From the moment your car/ambulance/tuk tuk drives you through the smartly dressed security guys, to the fresh, open plan foyers and entrance halls you'll feel like you are on a holiday... albeit a bloody painful one!

I taught English at some of the better known hospitals in Bangkok and the nurses are enthusiastic, willing, smart and attractive. Not like the coven of aging witches or inexperienced college junky trainees from YOUR country! (Take your pick but by YOUR country I'm refering to any western country.)

In the UK we have somethuing called 'Auxilliary Nurses.' This just means foriegn hotel porter who hands out (hopefully the correct) medicines. Not here. Even the more district and remote hospitals have dedicated local caring staff.

Of course they won't have the ridiculous machines that ping and look like they belong on the set of Star Trek, but you'll probably survive quite nicely without them!

[Snick]

Another point to ask about is coverage outside of Thailand

My policy provides insurance when I am outside of Thailand, but only if I am outside of Thailand for less then 60 days per year.

[SamplerDoc]

Best Insurance Policy is to Not get Sick
but if your gonna get sick the above advice from SB et al is good too

[Bravo]

Been stung on insurance before (not enough coverage or very expensive). An agent that says there are only two companies offering different coverage clearly doesn't know what they are talking about. Not sure what to suggest but there must be one of the members out there with a good, qualified insurance contact.

[moe666]

Sorry about the misunderstanding, worded the post incorrectly. My friends brother represents Bupa and AIG.
Just trying to provide a contact to anyone who is interested in investigating the purchase of health Ins. and no I donot recieve a referal fee.

[allstar88]

about how  much are we talking about for a yearly insurance cover in los ? and what if you came down with something big like cancer could you fly to uk and still get the nhs? i also agree that thai hospitals are good but getting to them in a rush in bangkok is a non starter!

[PigDogg]

(stogie bear @ Apr. 24 2007,18:47) Anyone fresh to this so called 'third world' country will get a shock when they see the opulent care, coverage and facilities by these fantastic hospitals.

From the moment your car/ambulance/tuk tuk drives you through the smartly dressed security guys, to the fresh, open plan foyers and entrance halls you'll feel like you are on a holiday...

I stayed for two nights in Bangkok-Rayong Hospital and it was nicer than my hotel in Pattaya.  But then I only pay 600 a night for my Pattaya room.      

I wasn't sick my teerak had a problem with her tonsils and in the upscale farang hospitals your friends or family members can stay with you.

Aside from the comfort and freindliness of the staff my impression is that the quality of care is superior to that of Western hospitals.  But that's just an impression;  I'm not qualified to make that assesment.

I like the idea of the "health card".

Which insurance programs offer health cards?

I linked the BUPA website but it neither has rates nor a list of participating hospitals.  Anyone have this info?

Now teerak eventually went home to Issan to have the tonsilectomy; the doc said the surgery would be 70K baht and teerak implied it'd be only a few thousand back home with her mama's card.

It seems (and we have a big language barrier) that she must go home for cheap health care.  How much would it cost for her to have a plan that she could use in Pattaya?

Lastly, what plans do you guys have?

When I move to Thailand I'd want a plan that:

1) has a high coverage limit
2) but I'm willing to pay a high deductible to lower the premium
3) hassle free.  i don't want to pay out of pocket and fight for reimburement.  i want to show the card and get treated
4)i want access to the best hospitals
5) few exclusions (BUPA does not cover anything caused by an STD nor does it cover HIV)

BUPA Thailand

[mardhi]

I will probably go against the general consensus here as I am extremely cynical of medical insurance, at least in Thailand. After 12 years as an expat with a company paid BUPA Gold policy that cost circa $3,000 year (ie $36,000 over the time I was with them) and to which I claimed the total of $0 in that time, I have a strong view about self insurance. Coupled to the fact that I have also had DVT (deep Vein Thrombosis) - my suspicion is that any insurer while happy to take the premium would basically in the event of a claim say "Oh well its related to that pre-exisiting condition - so tough luck, we aint paying". I have worked on the basis that being admitted to Bumrungrad for about 5/6 days - seeing countless experts etc and a bill as I recall for about 80,000b (for the DVT) - I can afford to settle almost any claim myself, and basically self insure. I have a big problem with insurers saying what is and what is not included - not least of all, which doctor or specialist I can see at their expense - hence thats the route I have gone down.

Others may have completely different views, as did I until I realised quite how much had been paid out - coupled with the fact that I could afford to pay for most things that popped up. However saying that, I also have the govt insurance scheme for employed people + about 5,000,000b of medical coverage on my car insurance (which is the most likely 'risk' as I see it for a guy my age - ie I am in a serious car accident).

I have heard way too many stories of Thai insurers doing almost anything to avoid paying a claim and frankly if I am in that position, id rather choose my own options.

Cheers
Mardhi

[jadeite]

A lot of insurance in the west is 80-20. Insurance pays 80%, you pay 20%. Well guess what in Thailand medical care is so cheap, even world class hospitals are 80% cheaper than the west. So there is no point to insurance because just by being in Thailand you get 80% "coverage" by default.

The only type insurance that would interest me is something cheap that I would never use should I stay reasonably healthy. Basically a plan that covers nothing under 1 million baht and 100% over it. But I don't know if there is anything even remotely similar to this ideal offered so I have remain self insured while living in Thailand for years now. Should I need a 100 million baht surgery then my position is oh well that's life, see you on the other side.

[Guest]

Yes, but Mardhi, you're young, and most problems aren't so expensive. I agree with you that now it's pretty easy to just pay out of the pocket. But the issue is always the 'Big Whopper' where you need serious, costly treatment, and then you're toast. It's a roll of the dice.

I cannot say enough good things about Thai hospitals and staff. They are near perfect. I've been to 2 Thai-local hospitals, and while not as beautiful as Bumrungrad, they also were pristinely clean, good rooms, good staff, good service, all doctors educated in the West.

But it is not only the building and the staff. It is also, strangely, the state of medical equipment and the system.

Dentists, eye doctors, and hospitals frequently have far newer equipment than in the west. My friend had both eyes lasered to improve his vision. He looked in Hong Kong, Singapore, and Thailand. The most modern lasers were in Bangkok. Likewise, I'd asked about teeth whitening, and was told the way it was done in Canada isn't done anymore in Thailand, it is too 'old'.

And the process is -- walk-in. To anyone. A heart surgeon. A dermatologist. An Endocrinologist. In Canada you have to see your family doctor first, who figures out if you warrant seeing a specialist, then you get in about a 3 month queue (one time I was told there was a 9-month queue for an optometrist) to see them. And God forbid if you have to do a second visit (almost certain).

I will never forget my first visit to Bumrungrad where I just walked in to the Dermatology section, off the street, and asked to see a doctor. A beautiful nurse, with good english, in an absolutely pristine white outfit and cap said, "Sir, I'm really sorry, but is it ok if you wait 10 minutes?". I almost thought she was joking. She wasn't. This is at the No.1 hospital in Thailand.

On a different topic...anyone check out insurance for personal goods (like the contents of your house?). I found the policies and coverage pitiful here and am getting insured from Canada. For example, the Thai companies max out at about 200,000 baht or so of coverage, and won't cover your camera if it gets stolen outside the house. The Canadian coverage is unlimited, and covers theft or loss anywhere.

[stogie bear]

I agree with Mardhi's general sceptisism about how insurance works and Ziggy is also correct with his anecdotal support of the Thai health care system.

But what is this 'whopper' that you talk about? If I had cancer that needed ongoing specialist treatment I would go back to the UK, as I suspect would Mardhi. What other 'whoppers' are there that can't be paid for with cash?

I've made three trips to my local hospital this year and the charges for each visit average about $20 or so. That includes medicine and a chat with a Doctor.

Two years ago my friend was diagnosed with inoperable cancer and spent the last two months of his life dying in the same hospital with pain drugs and food etc. I know he had no money to pay for any of this so why did they let him stay? He eventually died and his wife took what was left of his body away for a Buddhist burial.

But after all is said and done I haven't heard enough bad things aboiut the Thai insurance industry that makes me abandon it completely as an option in later years...

[PigDogg]

(stogie bear @ May 19 2007,21:49) But what is this 'whopper' that you talk about? If I had cancer that needed ongoing specialist treatment I would go back to the UK, as I suspect would Mardhi.

But an American can't just go back home and get treated for free.  

Maybe if you're 65+ and have Medicare, not really sure.