Finding an apartment & teaching in BKK

[Guest]

Soi 62, where May has an apartment, is about 7,000 / month, all included (internet, phone, TV), fully furnished. Brand new apartment. Many foreigners.

Around the Universities, there are always flats for about 3,500 / month, very clean, internet, blah, blah.

These are 1 room type places, but that gives you an idea. It's not so bad to look just adjacent to Universities (er, because the students nearby). And, they always hover in that price range, and are extremely convenient (little shops, eating places, laundry, ..., all at University prices).

[stogie bear]

You wouldn't want to raise your new adopted family in student digs. Despite the attraction of the rent price these places would soon become way too cramped and inconvenient for 3 people. So, too, would almost anything for under 10,000 Baht near the Sky Train.

If you DO decide to share a one roomed apartment with your girlfriend and her kid then you had better be very very very much in love. The closeness of living on top of each other will soon take it's toll.

As for a temporary serviced apartment while you are looking for work... The prices shoot up for families but for one person or a couple you should be able to get a satisfactory room for about 20,000 for a three months lease.

If you are seriously looking for a cheap apartment on the BTS for less than 15,000 Baht then I give your relationship about 6 months. If you are prepared to move into a house out of town for 7,000 to 10,000 Baht then I'll give your relationship more than a year.

Obviously the BTS location is important for you. I have no idea why as you don't even know where you'll be working yet! Many university jobs provide family housing but they pay shite. Good private schools will pay (maybe) up to 60,000 a month but have all kinds of deductions and extras knocked off plus you can say goodbye to your family life.

Teaching freelance for a language school for corporations can pay a starter of up to 700 Baht an hour but the the income is not regular and depends on available contracts.

I managed to do all kinds of teaching form my townhouse out in the sticks. My rent for this great place was 3,500 but I was miles away from the town centre. On the upside I had a great quality of life in a good neighborhood on my days off. I usually got buses and was rarely late for work.

Be VERY careful when applying for work... NEVER EVER EVER hand over your original documents (degrees/passports) to anyone ever. This is the number one mistake that teachers make with schools who want you to work for them. You'll never see them again and that's a promise. Take originals PLUS plenty of copies - smile and say firmly that you'll keep hold of your original documents.

Ask about all the deductions that you'll be making. If they tell you you are paying tax then you MUST get THEM to get you a tax ID number or you'll (possibly) be deported for evading tax while the employers are skimming your wages.

There is no such thing as a "good company to work for" in Thailand. They are all on the take and will screw you out of money and make you work more hours for free and attend duties that you want no part of, etc. there are no exceptions to this.

Your happiness factor will be determined by how much bullshit you can tolerate and your ability to either say 'No!' or lie and excuse yourself from the extra duties and lessons you'll be asked to do. for example - you'll be asked to attend the flag rasing and assemblies and gate duties from 7 in the morning even if you don't have a class untill 10 o clock. That's because the parents like to see the farang teachers and the school owners like to show them off. This is unpaid work.

I could write a bookon all the stuff that you'll find out for yourself soon enough, but be smart and be careful.

Once you say 'Yes' to something remember that you can never say 'No' the next time. You'll be the favourite teacher at times and the least favourite at other times depending on the other staff... they'll find a way to dump you in the shit, believe me. Even if they totally fabricate something!

As for teaching - throw everything you learned in the west out the window..

Parents send their kids to school to pass exams and NOT to learn stuff!

Forget teaching and concentrate on being popular and pass all your students all the time, even if they never show up for class. This way everyone is happy and you'll have a job for life.

[Guest]

Stogie bear

You are about the 5th person to tell me not to put such emphasis on living right in the city. One friend from Phuket said that once I get situated in a job, tell my gf to go find an apartment. She will better roaming around the area than I will. Even though she hasn€™t lived in BKK before (she lived outside the city), being Thai, her verbal abilities will be the big plus compared to Mr. Farang (me) showing up to look at an apartment. They also said you will probably see a difference in price per month between her and I too. Everything we have ever bought in Thailand always has 2 prices€¦..her price and my price.

But I do have to have a 1 bedroom apartment,. Living in a room is ok when your vacationing but for everyday, I have to have some space to get away from the TV (Thai videos 12 hrs a day drives me crazy) and it€™s just a healthy thing to be cramped into one room. At least by telling me 20,000 for a service department at least gives me an idea of what to pay.

I did mention to my GF about a house somewhere out of town and she keeps saying how expensive it would be to get to town, but I have lived in cities here in the states and it€™s always been doable. I think sometimes they think you always have to ride in a taxi everywhere. I have ridden my fair share of buses and it€™s no big deal and once you get your bearings in where you have to go, it€™s not a big deal.

I didn€™t mean to make it sound that I HAD to be on the BTS, it€™s just an idea that was swimming around in my head€¦I am looking at convenience but I€™m also looking at price and practicality. But priority #1 to me though is getting the job and then the place to live. The short-term service apartment should be easy to get.

You mention about living in the sticks and then having a good quality of life on days off, you€™re the second person who told me they have lived this way. Very Good Point!

Now for teaching in Thailand€¦..I have heard the horror stories and though some would say that I€™m well prepared because people have told me a lot over the past year, I doubt I would ever be fully prepared as you have said too. You never realize how much people try to stick it to you until they€™re doing it. One huge piece of info though was about the documentation. I never thought about that they might take my degrees and then I would end up having to fight to get them back.

I have been teaching all summer here in the states and we were just discussing it yesterday the fact that our administration here doesn€™t appreciate much of what we do. We have a brand new school opening in 4 weeks and even though the district has spent millions on this prison looking high school, they still expect miracles from us. I mentioned that on another forum, they told me that I would feel like this daily from the administration in Thailand.

Simply put, I will be a body to them, plain and simple and I will get NO support from anyone. Everyone looks after themselves, but that it€™s ok too because everyone is getting screwed by the schools administration too. The school will look at me (an American with 2 degrees) as a warm body that they can show off. But if I expect any form of respect from administration, it won€™t happen€¦.EVER. The only time I will suspect any respect is when they want something and as you stated, they will always want something, so always keep your guard up. They will try and screw me every chance they get. Lastly, I have been told not to take it so seriously though, go to work, have a good time with the kids, and just leave the job at school and enjoy Thailand for what it is.

Stogie bear as I stated previously, you guys (Stogie, Mardhi, Ozzie€¦.ect) in here give us valuable info about Thailand, not just on LB€™s and the bars but about other concerns we have and believe me you make me personally laugh usually on a daily basis, but it€™s also invaluable and very much appreciated. Thanks to you all€¦..

Nhscotsman

[divertwo]

..I love to read this info as it gives all us "dreamers" some inside, real life info to plug into our own relocation equation. I'm curious NHScotsman what type of visa you have obtained and from which consulate here in the States. From what I have read, some consulates seem to be more generous in the Visa's they issue....and some people say avoid the consulates all together and use the "honorary consulates" that are in a few cities.

[stogie bear]

I did mention to my GF about a house somewhere out of town and she keeps saying how expensive it would be to get to town...

She's wrong and she knows it. Public transport and cabs are very very cheap here. I suspect there are other reasons she doesn't want to live in the suburbs.

I never thought about that they might take my degrees and then I would end up having to fight to get them back...

You'd lose that fight - I've seen it a thousand times.

Simply put, I will be a body to them, plain and simple and I will get NO support from anyone. Everyone looks after themselves, but that it€™s ok too because everyone is getting screwed by the schools administration too. The school will look at me (an American with 2 degrees) as a warm body that they can show off. But if I expect any form of respect from administration, it won€™t happen€¦.EVER. The only time I will suspect any respect is when they want something and as you stated, they will always want something, so always keep your guard up. They will try and screw me every chance they get. Lastly, I have been told not to take it so seriously though, go to work, have a good time with the kids, and just leave the job at school and enjoy Thailand for what it is...

Print that out and put it on the last door you walk through on your way out of your house to your next class.

It's the smartest thing you've ever written and may save your sanity! Good luck and I look forward to meeting you.

[Guest]

(stogie bear @ Aug. 09 2007,20:14)

I did mention to my GF about a house somewhere out of town and she keeps saying how expensive it would be to get to town...

She's wrong and she knows it. Public transport and cabs are very very cheap here. I suspect there are other reasons she doesn't want to live in the suburbs.

I never thought about that they might take my degrees and then I would end up having to fight to get them back...

You'd lose that fight - I've seen it a thousand times.

Simply put, I will be a body to them, plain and simple and I will get NO support from anyone. Everyone looks after themselves, but that it€™s ok too because everyone is getting screwed by the schools administration too. The school will look at me (an American with 2 degrees) as a warm body that they can show off. But if I expect any form of respect from administration, it won€™t happen€¦.EVER. The only time I will suspect any respect is when they want something and as you stated, they will always want something, so always keep your guard up. They will try and screw me every chance they get. Lastly, I have been told not to take it so seriously though, go to work, have a good time with the kids, and just leave the job at school and enjoy Thailand for what it is...

Print that out and put it on the last door you walk through on your way out of your house to your next class.

It's the smartest thing you've ever written and may save your sanity! Good luck and I look forward to meeting you.

Oh my dear you think€¦..€It€™s the smartest thing I have ever written€ and here I was thinking some of my past comments were of wonderful and insightful content€¦.Now I€™m depressed€¦..LOL (just kidding) I know exactly what you meant Stogie, but it€™s the truth though€¦..sad but true!

As soon as I read your comments this morning about living outside of BKK and then traveling into the city on a daily basis, I got on the phone to my GF in Surin and questioned her further about it and I stand corrected. I was wrong€¦.YESSSSSSSSSSS, it happens, I am wrong at times! She would rather live outside of the city and travel into the city. She said when she made the comment to me, she said she was thinking I wouldn€™t get on a bus but that was long ago when we first started to discuss living in BKK. Now she said it is much more cheaper and nicer to live outside the city, just as you said Stogie.

She said once I get my job, she will go and find the apartment/house and make the deal and then introduce me. She said as I did, she will pay a lot less than if I€™m with her. She informed me that when you go apartment hunting, she takes off the gold and dresses down and then goes€¦..having me tagging behind will only jack the prices up and up.

Thanks for the comments and I will try and post more insightful comments when I do post€¦.hahaha (just kidding).

Nhscotsman

[PigDogg]

(stogie bear @ Aug. 09 2007,00:54) Many university jobs provide family housing but they pay shite.

Since the pay is shite does this mean these jobs are easy to get?

Easy to get without teaching experience and no advanced degree?

I always wanted to be a professor and the pay is not important to me.

[stogie bear]

Yes and no and good for you, Ajarn!  

[stogie bear]

I'll clarify the answers above.

The university gigs are easy to get because they are so poorly paid. The government rates for a professor are the same regardless of the natiionality you hail from. But the Universities are also the strictest when it comes to ensuring that you are at least qualified on paper to do what they hire you for.

Any degree will do, though! Some very wll qualified people that I know have special arrangements with the universities so they will stay with them despite the poor pay and insulting housing allowance (which are set by the government and emulated by even many of the private colleges.)

For example - the teaching hours will all be scheduled over two or three days so you can take on a second job elsewhere. You won't have to stay on campus when you aren't actually teaching like native teachers. They won't be 'obliged' to attend summer camps which most teachers are forced to do. They won't be expected to enrol in extra curricular activities.

But at the end of the day the pay is rubbish and the upsides are not that great. The best paid jobs at the private schools hire teachers directly from abroad and they will of course have BEds as well as their first degrees. Some jobs may be available from inside the country, but you can imagine why a hirer would hire saps who haven't even seen the place, right? It's because the accomodation provided is a rat box or the classes don't have a/c or the students are spoiled little cunts or the Sound Lab has been stripped of all the decent equipment it ever had years ago and even the crap microphone no longer works.

And when you start you are suddenly 'filling in' for the teachers too hung over to show up or who never showed up at the beginning of term in the first place.

Hiring from abroad means they can conceal the Olympic sized ineptitude of the planning, the staff and the amenities available to teachers and students.

'Teaching' English in Thailand is not a rewarding experience if you head off for that classroom and try to empart your language skills with ambition and enthusiasm.

And here's another nugget of advice... NEVER EVER EVER share your personal life with ANYBODY you work with. Keep your distance from ALL the staff and that includes the friendly English guy who needs help with his lesson plans for tomorrow but who is really on the run from a sex offence back in ol' Blighty!

Keep your life to yourself and don't say anything to anyone that might be misunderstood, because if it can be then it will be!

[rxpharm]

(PigDogg @ Aug. 10 2007,09:55)

(stogie bear @ Aug. 09 2007,00:54) Many university jobs provide family housing but they pay shite.

Since the pay is shite does this mean these jobs are easy to get?

Easy to get without teaching experience and no advanced degree?

I always wanted to be a professor and the pay is not important to me.

Ahh, too bad SB answers are no to the easy to get without teaching experience and advanced degree!

Dr. PigDogg has a ring to it! But you will have to do it the hard way, get a PhD (piled high and deep) or Masters advanced degree!

[Guest]

Pigdogg, SB has hit the nail on the head in all his comments. But one crucial thing I found ever since I was in college was I€™m not in this to make the big bucks. I remember sitting in my college classes and hearing the young kids talk about making big bucks once they get out of school with their degrees and the professors were telling them, it€™s not going to happen.
The same goes for teaching in Thailand. If you€™re coming to Thailand to teach and you€™re doing it for the money, someone or something has REALLY misinformed you€¦haha. I€™m personally going to do it for the experience of living in Thailand for a few years, but with myself, I just have to support myself with whatever I make. But I have an advantage too in that I have no bills back in the USA and I€™m renting my house so I have an additional income there too.

I really don€™t like to offer advice to people on here about this subject because I am new about doing this and I€™m sure I will make mistakes with trusting people. But at least if I do have a question like you may have, people like SB are here to correct us. Just in the past few days, SB has given me some good points to ponder and I have looked into this for months and spoken with numerous teachers both here and in Thailand to get additional insight.

As far as having the degree, from what I have been told for months, Thai schools have been getting a lot of heat for hiring teachers without degrees€¦€¦ANY TYPE of degree, not just a teaching degree. I believe they had to clean out their teaching staff of deadbeats by May of this year too. I may it wrong but I had heard and read this in numerous postings and news repports.

SB€¦..thanks for the info of not letting people know about your personal life€¦.Good tidbit of advice, I€™m a very social person and would hate to have it work against me.

Nhscotsman

[stogie bear]

Here's an anecdote about my friend Mike who lost his job over a misunderstanding...

In class my friend was asked if he drank beer. (They smelled it on his breath from the night before.) He said 'Yes.'

They then asked him 'How much beer do you drink?'

He innnocently replied 'Oh - about 3 or 4 a day.'

He actually only drinks at night but the words he used were interpreted to mean that he drinks beer during the day - his pupils complained - he explained the error and was still fired.

There's a bit more to this tale, but you get the idea! Be careful what you say and who you say it to.

[Guest]

(stogie bear @ Aug. 10 2007,19:03) Here's an anecdote about my friend Mike who lost his job over a misunderstanding...

In class my friend was asked if he drank beer. (They smelled it on his breath from the night before.) He said 'Yes.'

They then asked him 'How much beer do you drink?'

He innnocently replied 'Oh - about 3 or 4 a day.'

He actually only drinks at night but the words he used were interpreted to mean that he drinks beer during the day - his pupils complained - he explained the error and was still fired.

There's a bit more to this tale, but you get the idea! Be careful what you say and who you say it to.

The same goes for any school. If you make comments or gestures to students, some let it roll of their shoulders and others run home and say to their parents......"Guess what Mr. Such N Such told me", then all of a sudden you have administration down in your face and you trying to figure out what was said and if it was even accurate. I have seen it a number of times and when I try and tell new teachers to keep a good amount of space between relationship with students both inside and school and outside, some think I'm just paranoid, but they just haven't learned yet.

I can't go into a store in the town here where I live that I don't get a hello from a student or a parent, but I ALWAYS keep my distance between my students and myself. I don't let any kids come to my house, ride in my car or hang out with me. I'm 47, why would I want to hang out with a high school student anyway. People are too quick to accuse others of things and I always have my guard up.

SB, sounds like my constant guard will serve me well in Thailand and thanks for the additional insight.....It's very much appreciated.

NHscotsman

[moe666]

NHS, poor advice on waiting to get the job after you arrive in Thailand. Most of the International Schools do there hiring at the big International job fairs around Jan. Feb.. Unless you are in the loop already working at a school and know the adminstrators from other schools then you can get the inside tract.

Afriend who is married to a Thai, speaks Thai, and has the degree and is a certified teacher had to spend 2 years in Korea before hooking up in Thailand now that he is in the system he can move around freely.

Check out the International Schools that is were the money is 30,000 to 40,000 a year plus housing allowance of 1,000 a month.

Good luck.

[stogie bear]

SB, sounds like my constant guard will serve me well in Thailand and thanks for the additional insight.....It's very much appreciated.

You have studied hard, Maestro... you will do well!  

Check out the International Schools that is were the money is 30,000 to 40,000 a year plus housing allowance of 1,000 a month...

  Assuming you are talking in American dollars... This is assuming that you are paid for every month including holidays (which is unusual!) you are saying that there are schools out there that are willing to hire you (if you are well qualified) for 100,000 Baht a month?

Most full time jobs require that you teach from between 16 to 24 periods a week... How long are the periods? 50 minutes or one hour?

Show me the fine print on this amazing 40K per annum contract please!

As for a 30K Baht housing allowance each month... for fucks sake... I'm not that drunk... yet!

I don't doubt that there are some adverts out there that claim to pay these stupid wages in Thailand, but I'll bet my last tot of Glayva that they don't exist!