When you are ready to explore....

[JaiDee]

Ok, based on a thread in another forum I will relate an experience I had within the past few years which may or may not interest some of you. It involves some spiritual awakening and also some deep soul-searching, so if that is not your thing it's probably best to move on to another thread.

Based on an article I had read in Mens Journal in April, 2008, I booked a trip to Iquitos in Peru.  The article was about a relatively new type of medicine, at least to westerners, which had been discovered in the amazon basin in the 30s and 40s by the famous Harvard botanist Richard Schultes.  New to the west, but in fact practiced by locals for 3000 years or so and still practiced to this day.

 The article intrigued me..... and of course I then went to the Internet for some more material and it was all there for me; articles and websites about "Ayahuasca" abound and once I studied it some more I knew it was something I wanted to try; a few weeks later my trip was booked and I was off to Lima first for 4 days and nights and then up to the jungle where the amazon connects Ecuador, Peru, Columbia and Brazil;  to say I was "out there" is putting it mildly.

          3 weeks in the jungle and 8 hardcore sessions later, I can honestly say it was an amazing experience.  What you do is spend time in a spirit house or medicine lodge, and drink the Ayahuasca drink; a concoction of vines, leaves and bark, all boiled in a large vat, which you then imbibe.....and promptly throw up about 45 minutes later, it is just so powerful it doesn't stay down.

  Then the Aya goes to work, for 5 or 6 hours..... they say it is like doing 100 visits to a psychiatrist all in one night, and they are not joking. This is no recreational drug and is nothing to be tampered with or under-estimated, it is very serious medicine. You also need the presence or 2 or 3 shamans at all times to guide you through the process; they have rattles and sing soothing chants, and being in that pitch-dark lodge with 20 other whitey's was quite an experience. From all directions you hear crying, laughing, screaming, more purging, shrieks of fear or anger, etc.....you wouldn't even believe it unless you were there, trust me.

            What do you see while on Ayahuasca?  That depends on you..... it is some serious soul-searching and since we have the strongest hard drive/memory bank in the world right in our own heads, more than any computer could ever have in regards to remembering what we have done and seen in our lives, this medicine brings it to the forefront and makes you deal with it; like it or not.  Some nights are dark and scary, some nights are blissful and 100 times beyond anything you can even imagine; but you can't control the Aya, it controls you.

I saw images in my head from when I was 4, 8, 10 years old.... teenage years flew by.....I saw my own birth, coming into the world at the first second of my life { I know, sounds crazy, but why would I make that up?]; I saw the spirit world, I saw things which I hadn't seen in years and thought were long forgotten; and, same as everyone else, I saw things which I wanted long buried appear before me to deal with whether I wanted to or not.

 In my camp I had rape victims, abused teenagers on the verge of suicide, drug addicts, emotionally-damaged people and other really messed-up sorts all wanting and hoping to be cured; as well as people like myself who were just plain curious of the whole process; and I promise you, it did not dissapoint.  

 I could go on much more here, or just send you to some interesting links which explain it much better than I ever could.  I can promise you that if 50 people read this thread, at least one of you will feel the call of this extremely powerful and helpful medicine and take a trip down there; I did, and frankly I can't wait to go do it again.

http://www.ayahuasca.com/

GREAT forum attached to that site also....

http://www.bluemorphotours.com/

The camp I went to

 Here is a  MUST read if you are still interested, although it is quite long; and you can't get a much more reputable source than Nat Geo;  doing Aya literally saved this ladies life.
 
http://www.nationalgeographic.com/ad...ures/peru.html

 Here are some cool, various photos.....

http://images.google.com/images?....&tab=wi  

 cheers    

[TEERAK]

That's very interesting JaiDee. I may be interested in trying such a thing in the near future. I personally believe it's possible to learn a few important things about yourself when in these f***ed up states of mind.

From what I understand Ayahuasca is just a method of taking DMT the recreational drug. How was the experience different from a typical psychedelic trip?

[strocube]

Wow, Jai Dee, I thought you may have been a fellow traveler and now I'm sure. While I've never had the Ayahuasca experience it's something I've been wanting to try for years. The closest I've come to anything like that is mushrooms.
If you're interested you should really check out the work of Terrence McKenna. He's written extensively on the subject. His best known, and my favorite book by him is True Hallucinations: Being an Account of the Author's Extraordinary Adventures in the Devil's Paradise. I highly recommend this book.
I was lucky that I got to hear this guy speak a couple of times before he died in 2000.
ISBN 0-7126-6108-5

I just recently picked up the Schultes book, Vine of the Soul. This is pretty much a compilation of notes and pictures gathered in the field over a span of some years in the Amazon basin.

William Burroughs, of all people has also written about the experience.

[Guest]

Very interesting thread jaidee.I have been interested in ayahuasca for a long time,and its good to hear from someone who's actually taken it.I remember reading a similar report a decade or so ago,written by a journalist who,under the influence said he "became" a fish ,and swam in the rivers,and he "knew what it was to be a tree".Pretty trippy!
I took acid as a teenager,and smoked plenty of dope,and got pretty fucked up with the drink and drugs,so my mid-bending days are well and truly over.But anytime i read a report like yours my addictive gene cries out"I gotta try that!!!"
They say all addictive behaviours are a low level spiritual quest .LSD itself was developed to give hopeless alcoholics a spiritual experience to overcome their alcohol addiction.Strange but true!
I am agnostic/atheist,so any mention of God/spirituality never sits that comfortably with me,but I believe there is a realm of cosmic conciousness we can access through ayahuasca /dmt or even plain old meditation.What do we call that realm or that spirit-maybe God,who knows?
Truth is also,I am also a little scared to go into a mental state I may not return from,I have myself stood with both feet straddling that thin line between sanity and insanity,and that is one scary place,believe me.I never want to feel that again.
Anyway jai dee,no one could ever accuse you of living a boring life ...

[jimslim]

(JaiDee @ Mar. 13 2010,01:34) From all directions you hear crying, laughing, screaming, more purging, shrieks of fear or anger, etc.....you wouldn't even believe it unless you were there, trust me.

           

Sounds like a night at the Penthouse Hotel



Seriously though , very interesting reading , I consumed a hell of a lot of acid trips and mushrooms in my teens and early twenties and they are the closest thing to your experience , you really open your mind but you must be in the right company or it can be the worst experience of your life .

I doubt if I would have the balls nowdays .

[strocube]

Hey Jai Dee, I was wondering, apart from the experience of the entheogen itself, how do you think it has affected your life since then? How has this changed you as far as relating to all the usual existential stuff that we deal with either consciously or unconsciously; as far as mortality, in your dealings with others, friends, family, your outlook on life and death, etc?
I realize that's a big and personal question, but apart from the experience itself I'm interested in its transformational aspects, the before and after, if you will.
It's not for nothing that in Spanish they call it "la purga" the purge. What got purged for you besides your lunch?
Thanks,
-J

[Guest]

I'm happy in my world and reckon I'll leave it at that for now

[guydesavoy]

(strocube @ Mar. 13 2010,06:33) Hey Jai Dee, I was wondering, apart from the experience of the entheogen itself, how do you think it has affected your life since then?

Was going to ask the same question...

I read about this about 20 years ago and wondered about the 'after effects' once you get back to 'civilisation'...

[El_hefe]

I consumed a hell of a lot of acid trips and mushrooms in my teens and early twenties and they are the closest thing to your experience , you really open your mind but you must be in the right company or it can be the worst experience of your life .

I doubt if I would have the balls nowdays .

jimslim

Amen brother.......

[deepthroat]

I saw an episode of "No Reservations" with Anthony Bourdaine on the Travel Channel where he ingested some of this. As a recovering addict, it's something I choose to refrain from despite the purported therapeutic benefits. It is, when all is said and done, a psychedelic drug much like LSD, mescaline, or psilocybin. And my experience has already shown me that I'm prone to abusing anything that changes the way I feel, so I stick to caffeine and hookers today.

I have heard anecdotal reports that Bill Wilson (the co-founder of AA) experimented extensively with LSD in the 50's or early 60's, thinking it was a cure for alcoholism. Don't know if that's really true or not, but I know it's not a cure for much that ails me today... the cure in my case is worse than the illness!

I'm not trying to denigrate your experience, but I do want to take the "woo woo it's a clinical experience" part of your report and put it into a slightly different context. What you've done is taken a psychotropic/psychedelic drug and used it in a very controlled, therapeutic setting. This is exactly how clinicians and therapists were trying to use LSD and other psychedelics right up until the FDA and DEA made them a schedule (something) drug, effectively making them offlimits for clinical use. There are still many therapists who use these drugs clandestinely for the same purposes. I've read reports that claim therapy regimens using these drugs allow patients to achieve the kinds of breakthroughs that take years or even decades of work in normal therapy sessions.

But, ultimately, it's still not a lot different from your garden variety LSD, mescaline, or psilocybin. It's merely the setting and the support that's different.

Glad it worked for you. I did a LOT of acid back in the 70's, and I believed it profoundly affected the person I am today, in both positive and negative ways. It opened up my "doors of perception" alright! And ultimately, it's led me to continue to question and investigate the things that others only take for granted. For that I am grateful.

[geezer]

(pentire @ Mar. 13 2010,06:38) I'm happy in my world and reckon I'll leave it at that for now  

Although I do like the quote from mythbusters "I reject your reality and substitue my own."

[JaiDee]

I'm pretty surprised at the {mostly] positive feedback from this thread ......I figured there would be a lot more naysayers.

But I just woke up and have a few errands to run so let me address all this better in a few hours, K?

[guydesavoy]

Ye of little faith

[JaiDee]

(travis bickle @ Mar. 13 2010,03:19) a journalist who,under the influence said he "became" a fish ,and swam in the rivers,and he "knew what it was to be a tree"


 I am agnostic/atheist,so any mention of God/spirituality never sits that comfortably with me


Anyway jai dee,no one could ever accuse you of living a boring life ...

Last part.....no question about it and I am very lucky, especially the past 10 years; it has been one helluva wild ride.

2nd part..... I am also agnostic/atheist and agree 100%. I hate it when anyone discusses religion or even spirituality.  It took this trip to kinda lead me into a spiritual existence and now I must [regrettably?] say that I do believe in some type of spiritual realm, but I am still 100% anti-religion. There is a huge difference between the two.


 First part..... I can relate.....being on Ayahuasca you feel one with nature, one with all living things, one with trees and plants and all animals; it's extremely hard to describe and unless you have been there it's impossible to know what he or I am talking about.

           For deepthroat, I completely understand your skepticism, trust me. You come from the acid age and enjoyed Pink Floyd shows and probably tripped out a buncha times and think that this is just an extension of that; I thought that  as well before I tried it, but I can assure you now that this is MUCH more, and totally different from just a typical drug trip-out.  This makes you see yourself in a whole different way, and deal with deep-seated problems which you may have been avoiding or hiding from for years and years, as well as appreciate the natural beauty around you more than ever. Unless you have tried it it's hard to just put it into the LSD/Mushroom catagory just because they add DMT-chacruna leaves into the mix; that is only about 25% of the concotion anyway, the actual power comes from the Ayahuasca vine itself.

LSD may do that also but I don't think in the same way; I can't be sure because I only tried it a handful of times in college and it wasn't for me.

           Truth be told, I had no magical or mystical reason for going to Peru! As did some of the others in my group, about 25 people mostly from the states and Europe. Lots of them were new-agers or people with really bad emotional problems {one 19-year old girl was on the verge of suicide; this was literally her last chance after years of psychiatry}, and many were repeat returnee's to Blue Morpho; one guy had been there 6 times already!

 Me?  I was just a curious guy, someone who had loved taking magic 'shrooms for years and years to expand my horizons and figured that this was just a better, advanced version of that and I wanted to try it out.  BOY was I wrong.....this is 100 times more intense, 100 times more powerful and very different;  it's not really a giggling, fun thing to do and in fact you could never take Aya and go to a club or a rave or some shit;  it's for exploring your own mind and contemplating life around you, not tripping out to some techno garbage. And in fact 3 of my nights were dark and disturbing and not fun at all; but if that is what is meant to happen to you at that particular time, you can't stop it and there is alay something new to learn either way; again, Aya tells YOU where you are going after you drink it, not the other way around. The other nights; pure bliss and kind of like having a 4 hour orgasm; can you even imagine that?

              It's magical..... it makes you realize that all life is inter-connected and that from the moment we are born we become part of a community of all living things, from plants and trees to birds, bears and everything in between.......{boring spiritual reference coming, beware!} it makes you realize that death is nothing to fear because indeed the soul does go on and in fact after we die where we go is much more preferable to where we are now.....it makes your senses clearer, your head less cluttered, your priorities put in better order.

In short, it's a great thing to do for any person and I would highly recommend it.

[JaiDee]

(strocube @ Mar. 13 2010,06:33) Hey Jai Dee, I was wondering, apart from the experience of the entheogen itself, how do you think it has affected your life since then? How has this changed you as far as relating to all the usual existential stuff that we deal with either consciously or unconsciously; as far as mortality, in your dealings with others, friends, family, your outlook on life and death, etc?
I realize that's a big and personal question, but apart from the experience itself I'm interested in its transformational aspects, the before and after, if you will.
It's not for nothing that in Spanish they call it "la purga" the purge. What got purged for you besides your lunch?  

OK, as you say it's kind of a personal question so I can't get too much into exactly what was purged, etc..... but I did definately feel that it changed my life for the better.  I saw some things which had bothered me since I was a wee lad and confronted them whereas before I just hid from them or didn't deal with them. Losing my father to heart failure at age 7 wasn't an easy thing for a small guy, neither was being raised as an Irish Catholic being loaded up with guilt and same as every person who reads here there were some things I'd prefer to forget about my childhood.  This medicine makes you face it, deal with it, purge it from your life and move on; good.

I mentioned mortality above.....I no longer fear death and in fact based on some of the things I saw and experienced I can almost say I look forward to it; strange but true.  The first month or 3 after returning from Peru  there were definate changes in my mood and my outlook on life, and everything smelled and tasted better and the small things no longer worried me.  Kinda like walking on feathers all the time, with a constant smile and just an overall good feeling.  That did pass;  however, I have heard from many of my fellow campers whom I stay in touch with that the changes stay with them forever and ever.

     This stuff sounds like nonsense to a lot of you and I can't blame you, I would've said the same thing myself 3 years ago.  But now that I have tried it I am 100% behind the healing and spiritual powers of this wonderful medicine.  BTW;  this stuff stays in your blood stream, I think forever.  No joke, because I can do strong magic mushrooms to this very day, even 2 years later, and somehow ''reconnect'' through them with the Aya and I feel the same trance-like state I felt in Peru and it's a wonderful gift.  Doesn't happen every time, but has happened maybe 5 times since I left there and it's truly amazing.

 Again, highly recommended to anyone who can afford it and has the desire to try something new.