Who killed JFK?

[pacman]

(JaiDee @ Mar. 03 2010,11:29) Again, for years we have been told there was some guy or guys on the ''grassy knoll''  [ a phrase only used here as far as I have ever seen] who fired while Oswald was firing;

I missed the significance of this reference to the "grassy knoll".

For JaiDee to admit that he has only ever read it here on his own thread confirms just how ignorant he is of what happened that day.

I know he doesn't want to bother himself with unsubstantiated facts but even the most cursory look at the thousands of articles & documentaries on the assassination of JFK would have exposed him to the expression over & over.

Hell, half the conspiracy theories focused on the "grassy knoll". It isn't a term I invented, I grew up reading about the 3 shady figures who were seen by dozens of witnesses on the "grassy knoll".

I am not bothered by what someone chooses to believe but please come into these discussions at the very least with some rudimentary knowledge of what all the fuss is about.

You started the thread asking for information that could change your opinion. I don't believe anyone who shows they haven't even looked at the conspiracy theories before is interested in doing so now.

[mirimark]

They do say Video Killed the Radio Star.   I really don't think it was Video who killed JFK.
My brother Bob Marley says JFK juked the Jamaicans out of a Lid of Herb.  Hey man them Jamaicans don't fuck around when it comes to their ganga mon'.

 I think the Russians were involved some how.  In co-hoots with Cuba.   Yes, I think Lee Harvey did it but enluew of a bigger conspiracy.
Just my opinion. I know my spelling sucks.

[Naang Faa]

(JaiDee @ Mar. 03 2010,05:29) I am sticking with what I have concluded since high school; it was a lone nutcase who wanted to make himself famous.

 

This only makes sense if he said "yeah,it was me" and take credit for
what you see as his motive...
x

[pacman]

MYSTERY SOLVED!!

Oswald was a sleeper for the KGB & was also an activist for the Free Cuba movement.

Even though the Russians were wary of Oswald as they realised he was a nutter, they recruited him after he went to live in Russia. Oswald maintained that he was disillusioned with life in Russia (and he probably was) but he returned to live in the US under orders from the KGB.

After taking office, John's brother the Attorney General Robert Kennedy ordered the execution of Castro regardless of what it took. In the short time he was in office, there were at least 8 assassination attempts on Castro's life. The Cubans turned to their great ally Russia & asked for help.

They were told that Russia had a sleeper agent in the US but before he could be trusted with such an order, he was asked to carry out a hit on General Edwin Walker. His shot missed but after Oswald's death, he was confirmed as the shooter.

Now he received his order to shoot Kennedy. And the rest is history.

How can I be sure of all this?

A German documentary made in 2006 was just played on local TV with interviews with all the major players. They produce actual KGB archival documents where Oswald is mentioned repeatedly. They interview the head of Cuban Intelligence & ask him why he was in Dallas on the 22nd of November & straight after the shooting, took a flight to Mexico City.

His part in the doco makes it all very confusing because he argues that he wasn't there & that the CIA planted all the evidence. Interviews with others completely contradict him but no one denies that Oswald was acting on orders.

So there you have your proof JaiDee. It is called Rendezvous With Death: Kennedy. I have only seen part 1 but I keenly await part 2.

EDIT: Here on Oz TV the documentary had the above name but I notice elsewhere Kennedy's name is not included in the title.

[pacman]

Here is the Wikipedia entry about the documentary. It is strangely stilted & leaves out most of what was uncovered in part 1.

I can't help but suspect the Wikipedia entry has been edited by "friendly forces".

Rendezvous with Death is a German documentary film that claims that G2, a secret service organization of the Cuban government, organized the assassination of U.S. President John F. Kennedy. The film first aired on January 6, 2006 on German television station Westdeutscher Rundfunk. It was directed by Wilfried Huismann.

Rendezvous with Death features interviews with four Cuban former secret service agents and an American FBI agent, and also cites documents from KGB and Mexican government archives.

A possible Cuban connection was investigated by the US immediately after Kennedy's death.

But an FBI officer sent to follow the Oswald's trail during a visit to Mexico was recalled after only three days and the investigation called off.

Laurence Keenan, now 81, said it was "perhaps the worst investigation the FBI was ever involved in".

"I realised that I was used. I felt ashamed. We missed a moment in history," Mr Keenan said.

Veteran US official Alexander Haig told the filmmaker that Kennedy's successor, Lyndon B Johnson, believed Cuba was to blame and feared a pronounced swing to the right if the truth were known that would keep the Democrats out of power for a long time.

Mr Haig - a US military adviser at the time and later a secretary of state - told the filmmakers Johnson said: "We must simply not allow the American people to believe Fidel Castro could have killed our president."

"He [Johnson] was convinced Castro killed Kennedy and he took it to his grave."

It was very interesting to learn that Oswald, contrary to the popular image of him being dull, was in fact an intellectual who mastered the Russian language very quickly, read all the great Russian authors & had memorised entire scores of famous Russian musicals.

His wife is revealed to be a KGB secret service agent & comes across as charming & intelligent in her interviews.

[Naang Faa]

(pacman @ Mar. 04 2010,13:17) They produce actual KGB archival documents where Oswald is mentioned repeatedly.

Would these be the same as the "official KBG documents" of UFO retrievals
and stuff like that?
x

[marshal]

WTF is wrong with you folk? Last time i spoke with seamus, he admitted that he was the gunman!

[Naang Faa]

That midget couldn't even look over the fence on the grassy knoll
x

[JaiDee]

(pacman @ Mar. 04 2010,19:17) A German documentary made in 2006

So there you have your proof JaiDee.

Pretty funny, Paccie

 You want me to believe the Germans?  For what?

  Oh, and it seems that 13 others believe the real truth of what happened that day, see the poll stats above; so it's not just me. Because nothing in this thread has changed our views, nor should it; it's just all recycled garbage from the 70's  

  Listen....if you want me to go away on this issue please present some 'credible' news source, not a buncha college kids from Berlin with a camera and a dream.

  * I have watched the news or read the newspaper daily since I was a teenager, about 30 years now; strangely enough, not ONE, and I mean not even ONE, news organization has ever presented these fairy tales which you and Travis and 3 or 4 others seem to think are FACTS to their viewing audiences. Why haven't they yet?

Are CNN, FOX, NBC, CBS, The NY Times, L.A. Times, Fleet Street, the BBC, and every other news-coverage group in the world also in on the conspiracy?  Come on.... because otherwise, actual PROOF that someone other than Oswald was in on the deal would have been presented by now, ''somewhere'' and by ''someone'' credible with a news organization to back it up; and yet it hasn't.

 A story like what you are proposing would be the lead, number one story for weeks and weeks on any of the above news outlets, plus every single other one in the entire world for a whole week or more; much MUCH more important than the O.J. trial, the death of Princess Diana, or the death of JFK junior, which all got substantial week- or even year-long coverage, and just below the attacks on the twin towers in terms of news importance.  

And yet some guy from Australia, a few german film-makers and some bloggers  all managed to pick up on it while they have all missed it?  Damn, you're good!

[pacman]

I wondered if you would ever comment on my post. As luck would have it, I have just watched Part 2 of the German documentary tonight.

I doubt you will be able to summon the courage to do the same. It isn't that I am worried about the veracity of what is in it, the truth is out now & this documentary has taken its place in history.

Here at home, friends who have never mentioned JFK in the 30 years I have known them are suddenly talking about what we have seen. And we are all amazed that it has taken over 3 years for an English translation to make it onto Australian television.

And to dismiss it as the efforts of some college kids is absurd - this has taken an enormous amount of funding to bring to the screen. Filming was done in the US, Germany, Russia, Spain, Mexico, Cuba & other countries they travelled to, to track down known witnesses. It was over a year in the making & not even Michael Moore spent as much money or time on a project.

There is none of the hyperbole Moore employs, everything is backed up by eyewitness accounts. It will shatter all illusions about trusting your government to tell the truth.

As for the news services you mention not revealing the real story, it will be a long time before they dare to broadcast this documentary. As the film makers themselves discovered when they went back to continue interviews the next day, witnesses had been got at overnight & just clammed up. Some 43 years later!!

The Mexican authorities arrested the head of Cuba's intelligence the afternoon of the shooting as he landed on a private flight from Dallas. He had met Oswald several times with witnesses confirming this yet, the whole time he is interviewed, he denies everything. President Johnson knew within hours of the shooting, of Oswald's Cuban connections & it was he who instructed that no one ever be told that Castro had ordered the hit.

Hoover ensured that Oswald never spoke at trial by the one flaw in their plan - the obvious silencing of Oswald by his man, Ruby. Nothing else pointed more strongly to a cover up than the "patriotic act" of a dying man.

And the saddest guy in the whole sordid affair? JFK's brother Bobby who had to live with the knowledge that the very guy he was counting on to bump off Castro was the same guy who tipped off the Cubans who then delivered a box full of money to Dallas.

It is a wonderful documentary JaiDee. Here is the evidence you demanded. Any more of your ridiculous denials only confirms that you are too afraid to learn the truth. Now watch it. You are not going to be able to have a good nights sleep till you do.

[JaiDee]

(pacman @ Mar. 11 2010,21:15) I wondered if you would ever comment on my post.

Here is the evidence you demanded. Any more of your ridiculous denials only confirms that you are too afraid to learn the truth.

Sorry Paccie, I don't read here every day and I oftentimes take a week or 3 off to do other things, which is why it took me a while to read your posts;  you also seemed put off that I always ''have to get the last word'' so at some point I have to stop responding, no?

''As for the news services you mention not revealing the real story, it will be a long time before they dare to broadcast this documentary. As the film makers themselves discovered when they went back to continue interviews the next day, witnesses had been got at overnight & just clammed up. Some 43 years later''

So, since this documentary has solved the big mystery, none of the main news outlets have picked up on it since 2006 because they are all scared?  The powers that be have the ability to intimidate every single person at CNN and NBC to NOT bring out the facts?   Wow, that is some serious power! Think seriously about what you are saying in that one line, man......think how odd that sounds, that whole news organizations of 1000 people or more can be forced to not bring us the truth, when that is their very job, because someone will make them ''clam up'' if they do.

      I will sleep perfectly fine not ever seeing this re-hashed tripe, thanks anyway, and will always have a good chuckle knowing there is at least one guy in Australia and probably a handful of others who wasted a few hours of their time watching it.

[pacman]

And that's fine by me.

I wasn't intending to post again when you started this thread & I regretted doing so after your rude response.

It was one of those unlikely coincidences that the real story came out right in the middle of this thread. I had already decided to let it rest.

I know you love to stir up the forum & I am happy you do so. I hope our paths cross one day, even if just to say hello. No arguments, that's for sure.

As for the documentary "Rendezvous with Death", at least remember the name because I promise you, this won't be the last time you ever hear of it.

Now that there is an English version available, other people are going to come across it via the net & sites like this one.

You might say, the wick has been lit.

I really never expected you would want to watch it, I am sure you would find it upsetting. As a patriot, there are some things you are better off not knowing.

[Torurot]

Not directly related to the topic, BUT if you bother to read Flat Earth news http://www.flatearthnews.net/ by far the best non fiction book I have read this year; it's perfectly possible for an organisation of 1000 people/journalist NOT to publish something if they are told not to by for eg. Mr Murdock!

"think how odd that sounds, that whole news organizations of 1000 people or more can be forced to not bring us the truth, when that is their very job, because someone will make them ''clam up'' if they do."

Odd indeed, but truth can be stranger than fiction.

[JaiDee]

(pacman @ Mar. 12 2010,15:57) I know you love to stir up the forum & I am happy you do so.

That was certainly true years ago Pacman, and the old moderator either loved it or hated it depending on just how far I went in agitating the masses.  But these days it's an older and much more mellow JD who pretty much only posts in this one room where maybe 1/2 of all forum readers read and it's pretty hard to stir the pot with just Fish box material......which, lets face it, can be found on most forums dedicated to these particular topics we cover in this room.

   You've made some good points, and I trust that you believe your views and it's not my intention to be rude with you. I guess I just can't be swayed on this one issue; many people agree with me and many agree with you as well, so in the end it seems we have come to a mexican standoff and just have to agree to disagree, deal?

''As for the documentary "Rendezvous with Death", at least remember the name''

Done.  It's easy to remember and I PROMISE that if it ever comes on History or National Geographic or Discovery, et al....I will check it out.

[alan1chef]

I think Oswald did it...alone...however...conspiracy theory abounds....