'Kreng jai!' Is it bullshit to you, to?

[EyeMahk]

(Stingray @ Mar. 16 2009,21:55) None of the scenarios discussed here have anything to do with Kreng Jai, think you have the wrong word.

Kreng jai and saving face are NOT the same thing. Here is a link to a good desc. of kreng jai (halfway down). Put away your western way of thinking in trying to understand what kreng jai means. It is NOT a simple concept. Once you start to understand it, many of the actions Thai people take will make more sense, and you can differentiate actual displays of kreng jai vs. attempted manipulation of foreigners.

Here is a link to a good description of kreng jai:
Link: http://studyinthailand.org/study_a...._1.html
(look halfway down that page)

A very good book (a masterpiece, in fact) is by Suntaree Komin; Psychology of the Thai People: Values and Behavioral Patterns. The complete chapter 7 (National Character in the Thai Nine Value Clusters) is here. It is a good read if you are actually interested in this topic:
Link: http://studyinthailand.org/study_a....es.html

The uniqueness of this book is that it is a study of Thai behaviors and values conducted by a Thai researcher, rather than the usual studies of Thais done by westerners.

[donnnnnny]

(dax spadackel @ Mar. 16 2009,02:19) I find it quite funny myself how greng jai or'' saving face'' moves between whores and there customers in the kingdom, i find it repressive in the thai workforce as ive worked in thailand before but find it fuking pathetic and hilarious how all kinds of nonsense get put into the catagory of loosing face, does anybody else out their find it funny that old out of shape men with young boys dressed up like girls who sell their mangina publically are always bringing up greng jai issusues, i mean its enjoyable to me to realize as an adult that theres so many flakes out there..no dont take offense, no names have been mentioned im just curious if any of you have any insights on this your self that i might enjoy. its actaully one of the main things that keeps thai people in line so well but also represses them..figured i might be entertained or learn something from u guys..will see, thx dax.

greng jai is just a way of shirking your responsibilities.THey act like kids and get away with what they have done.
And we are all doing it in the west now, talk about pathetic,
donnnnnny

[Guest]

I think what get missed a lot is that respect is earned not given. Therefore, the punter hwo thinks he can treat a P4P ladyboy because he has paid deserves no respect just like a P4P ladyboy who cheats, robs her customers. Same applies to the little vandal. Just my 2,000 kip worth.

[robbo]

(paultain @ Mar. 16 2009,21:01)

(mister_smith @ Mar. 16 2009,19:40)  Silly Cow

Yeah Dax I hear ya, It pisses me off big time how these fucking Thais always use the face crap to weasel out of any difficult situation

Bitch kicks up shit because you choose another LB well don't retaliate because they'll lose face

Chiseling cunt bar owner pads your bill, well don't retaliate because they'll lose face

Scamming cunt LB wants to leave after 1 hour into a LT and still wants the full payment, well don't retaliate because they'll lose face

When you are the stupid one that this has happened to........... then the only one who has lost face is you

actually this guy has hit the nail spot on...................................how many times have YOU and everyone else myself included been messed about by a bar girl or lb, through no fault of your own..........and then expected to still be the "nice farang and show that you can still walk as well as the next wallet"...........there are times when it seems as tho their saving of face(and payment regardless of service) is so important as to render you and your face,wallet and good nature totally irrelevent......................so whats that about................i dont need an answer............i know!

[PigDogg]

This Kreng jai concept underlies a significant portion of everyday interpersonal behavioural patterns of the Thai. Its closes meaning is "to be considerate, to feel reluctant to impose upon another person, to take another person's feelings (and "ego") into account, or to take every measure not to cause discomfort or inconvenience for another person".

Perhaps the dancers and waitstaff at the gogos should undergo kreng jai training. "Buy me drink" is not kreng jai.

[jimslim]

I shave my face every day in Thailand , I use a Gilette Mach 3 .

Those Thai's are so lucky they rarely have to shave face .

[robbo]

yep, as i previous posted when a bargirl asked me for a drink despite the fact i hadnt shown her the slightest bit of attention,in fact i tried to avoid her and obviously also...................i got called ugly.............so how does that fit in with the "nice thai way" and considering other peoples face? fickle is what ive learnt thais to be.............but then there are the bar workers and ordinary thais.........mayby a little different,i dunno. who cares,i just dont put up with the bullshite anymore.smile and walk way.

[dax spadackel]

jim slim you cracked me up, i like your attitude. NIce to hear so many nice things said about the greng jai, i actually agree that its one of the things that makes the thais so cool to be around, their just like all people on the earth, largely full of shite, just so happens that thier version comes with some charm i guess or is it chicks with dicks with sexy legs that gets us...also nice to hear some honest rants, i mean common, there is some serious fuked up stuff that passes for saving face and its good to know that your not all so excepting of it just cause your from planet farang...........................

[kahuna]

(PigDogg @ Mar. 17 2009,05:28) "Buy me drink" is not kreng jai.

Perhaps...But it is what happens when the Thai culture collides with many others...

I'd wager that they are as confused about our cultures as we are about theirs...

Simply because they can speak a bit of English or we can speak a bit of Thai doesn't mean that they or we fully understand the words...

[si geena]

Greng Jai is reciprocal and mutually beneficial.

1. The gf's mom knows my family and I love the snacks that she makes. And she'll make a big bunch of it, makes sure she uses fresh ingredients, makes sure it's packed neatly for shipment in a foam container.

2. I'll make sure the shipment gets to SG. All enquiries as to what it is, I'll carefully explain to the airport staff that, "My gf's mom made this for my family..."

3. My mom and dad, upon receipt of this snacks and gifts, tells me to thank gf's mom.

4. I in turn, transmit this to my gf and her mom.

5. My mom starts making her batch of snacks and asks me when I'm heading over to visit my gf once more.

It's worked very well for us so far.

[TEXASMAC]

Saving face?" Its the same in any corporation in the world so why should this be any different. I sell my work and skills to whoever pays me the most. I guess that makes me a " managerial whore". I have been screwed at work more times than half the lasys at Nana.

[dax spadackel]

i taught english in thai, not money only job in the kingdom but before class are senior teacher who was training us at the time told us not to ask the older students questions they didnt now in from of the younger students, face would be lost as well as his 1st grade comprehension of english but the face was more important in front of a bunch of adults with 3rd grade comprehension, this is the kind of nonsense theese insecure thais have that i dont go for....like a mystis worships soomething he doenst understand greng lie leads to ingnorance being exalted, and yet still something very human gets a chance to breath, but lests face facts its bullshite on top of kee nok......ciao

[Stogie]

i taught english in thai...

And here I was blaming the Thai people for their poor standards of English comprehension!

Do Thailand a favor and please never teach them English again! I promise that they'll be better for it!

[EyeMahk]

(dax spadackel @ Mar. 17 2009,10:55) i taught english in thai, not money only job in the kingdom but before class are senior teacher who was training us at the time told us not to ask the older students questions they didnt now in from of the younger students, face would be lost as well as his 1st grade comprehension of english but the face was more important in front of a bunch of adults with 3rd grade comprehension, this is the kind of nonsense theese insecure thais have that i dont go for....like a mystis worships soomething he doenst understand greng lie leads to ingnorance being exalted, and yet still something very human gets a chance to breath, but lests face facts its bullshite on top of kee nok......ciao

Yes, teachers with "1st grade comprehension of english" are a real drag.

Dax, you're winding us up now, right?

[mister_smith]

maybe he means 1st as in #1 like grade A