Some people have money to burn...

[kahuna]

(69billy @ Dec. 25 2008,05:27)

(kahuna @ Dec. 24 2008,05:32) Second, what makes you think he has a better time here than others...Because he says so or you think he does...

I don't say so..Any one can see the proof..Lets see yours...

It wasn't directed to you...it was a question to the OP...ask him why he posted his comment...learn to read...

However, you sound like a broken record Billy...I have no need to post photos of myself all over the internet to prove to myself I am having a good time with my life...

You really do need to grow up a bit Billy....

[kahuna]

(69billy @ Dec. 25 2008,05:40)

(kahuna @ Dec. 24 2008,08:05) , I have learned not to ask them what they charge...

I pay them what I want to pay...

Guys this is a BAD BAD advice...

Damn, you do indeed have a comprehension problem...

That's not advice...That's what I do...

You do what you do...Others do what they do...

There is no right or wrong...Everyone is free to do
whatever they like...

Now should I use the wanker icon like you do with everyone who disagrees with you or what? I'll choose the or what...

[as it is]

I feel a bubble has been created in prices st/lt due to the girls internet exposure.Today there is so much ladyboy material attracting a new generation to los.The bubble is about to burst.2009 prediction more stay at home punters/wankersmeans cheaper prices formongers to los.But i always feel you cannot put a price on a person to fulfil a lifestyle choice in los.Just keep breathing for ladyboy action.

[69billy]

(kahuna @ Dec. 25 2008,05:26) That's not advice...That's what I do...

You do what you do...Others do what they do...

There is no right or wrong...Everyone is free to do
whatever they like...

I may sound like a broken record but ONE thing you shouldn't forget is there are lots of guys looking at this forum as a source for info..
Hotels..Bars..What LB to shag or not..and how much to pay...I was lucky to meet an expat at my first time ever in LOS who gave me an idea what to pay...
Now days i may ask may not... I know the price..But for a newbee it could be a nasty surprise...

[paultain]

I do agree with Naag Faa, that the LB's have higher maintenance costs, surgery, cloths, make-up, hair saloon and really make more of an effort than the majority for GG's that just throw a t-shirt and shorts on to make a score.

But when all that's said and done, after the surgery (the highest costs), and maintaining that higher income, end up filling their faces with substances such as ya-ba, and speed, with the extra surplus of money, they don't know what to do with.

Some people are forgetting the millions of the ordinary Thai workers, with the normal jobs. You know the ones, the receptionist, the maid that cleans you room, the guy on the building site, the shop assistant, the average cop on the street, and the guy/girl who collects the garbage. Ever stop to think how much their monthly wage is, to take home to feed, cloth, and keep a roof over their family's heads.

€˜Hotel guess friendly', any wonder you can get an attitude or dirty looks, from receptionist of your 5* hotel, ever stop to think what's going through her mind? Could be this, "Look at that bitch, going up with him to his room. She's gonna make more in one night, than I make the whole month."

And like Bill69 says, €˜Ask first' you might be surprised on the answer. There are times when I come across a stunner, and ask "How much?" with a figure in mind, and surprisingly the answer would come back a little more than half of the figure. But in general I have never recalled haggling over a price.

[rxpharm]

from the Picture Post Forum. There is another agenda going on with this thread that has nothing to do with the Picture Post forum, despite the OP putting up a few pics.

[rxpharm]

paultrain, whatever issues you have with lbs and their fees, you have not supported any of your points with facts - strictly opinions and feelings. The comments in your latest post comparing the income of lb bargirls to traditional workers misses out on the important point of how long their working careers may be. Bar girls may have a span of 5 years at their peak earning potential and probably around 10 years maximum. So your comparison is invalid. What the lbs spend their money on is irrelevant to your topic as well.

As for "guest friendly" attitudes of the hotel receptionist that is totally irrelevant to the topic you brought up in the first place and your use of the term "bitch" reflects your attitude as you cannot know the attitude of the receptionist unless you have asked her what she thinks.

The whole topic you've brought up seems to indicate you have an axe to grind for whatever personal motivation. Perhaps you were burned in the past during your time in LOS.  You have admitted you are not affected by other punters paying "above the market rate". You still haven't defined it either and have ignored many of the points other posters have asked you to address.

[Homeless Traveler 2]

supply and demand...simple as that.

lots of things impact supply...yes, including the cost of transforming into one of our fav creatures of the night as well as then maintaining and improving her looks...then for some, I guess prevailing wages in other professions and the availability of jobs in those other professions at any given moment has an impact as well (all of us have seen ple.nty attractive non-p4p LBs around LOS)...and then i would guess simple human nature also impacts supply a bit as many in the p4p arena (LBs and GGs) are there in large part cuz they want to make a lot of money (relatively) in as short a time and with as little effort as possible (we all have met at least one stunner that turned out to be a dead fish)...and then there is probably the smallest slice of the pie, the younger ones who do it cuz they are addicted to the thrill of living as close to the life of a rock star as they will ever get (party all night, sleep all day).

but, all that said, here is my own little supply and demand equation...and it applys to all p4p, not just LBs as i enjoy both LBs and GGs...i hope it adds to the conversation.

i am fortunate that i have the means to do as i please within reason...and i am thankful for that...but i do not squander my money either (in any part of my life, not just p4p) as i feel that is the best way to piss off the fates and see my luck turn...

i have engaged in p4p in many of the hot spots...Brazil, Venezuala, Columbia, Dominican Republic, Costa Rica, Guatamala, Czech Republic, Russia, Ukraine, Japan, Thailand, Cambodia...not everywhere, but a nice sampling of what the world has to offer.

Typically, my first trip into a new country is made out of curiousity, generally because ive read something on the net or a friend has gone and told me something that tweeked my interest. I will generally stay at a nice hotel, search out the p4p hot spots and sample the offerings, probably paying the going rate for newbies. But, if I return, then Ive gotten to know the ropes and my pencil sharpens and i will generally improve upon the quality of my experience as well as pay less for it. I have also probably found a similar hotel at a lesser rate. With each succeeding trip, quality of experience continues to improve and costs wil continue to decline, all things being equal.

However, when a fundamental shift occurs (say as it did in Prauge or Moscow) where the cost of the p4p market goes up significantly (a model quality girl went from 30usd to 300usd in a short time) because there were simply more tourists and locals with more money driving up demand, it no longer is attractive to me as a market (since the world can be my playground) and I move on. Simple market forces at work. But when I stopped going, not one girl missed a meal as a result. If and when there is another fundamental shift (ie world depression), then I might return...but i wish that on no one and dont expect it to happen.

Costa rica is a great example of how things other than just money can impact the p4p market...over 15 years, the girls in the p4p market have gotten a bit older (instead of lots of hotties in the 18 to 21 range, most are now a bit worn and 23 to 28) and a lot more hardened attitutes, but basically can be had for the same price if you know how to talk to them. Well, i am guessing this is because there are a lot more opportunities for girls to do other things and still make a good wage as the costa rican economy has developed...and a lot more of the ones still in the profession are simply getting tired (who wouldnt). Again, no problem and I make no judgements, I simply moved on to greener pastures...enter the LOS.

I am sure that someone who has been going to LOS for much longer than the 3 years I have (or someone living there) has a very different perspective than i do...I dont know what the bars and girls and LBs were like 10 years ago, my reference point on all this and the rates charged begins with 3 years ago as its baseline. I can tell you that market forces are still at work though...evidenced by the fact that I have no desire to ever go to bangkok again, pattaya suits me just fine. The hotels are half the cost for equal accomodations (I use Majestic Suites in BKK and Pattaya Bay Resort in Patts), the girls and LBs are nearly half price as well, look just as good if not better, there is a much greater supply to choose from in all categories, and i have found their attitudes much better (though i know this is subjective). I enjoy every minute spend there...largely because Pattaya has a large supply of pretty young gg/lb that are willing to exchange their time for my money at a rate that i consider a bargin...and so long as that, when combined with the other costs associated with going there (time to travel, cost of airfare, cost of hotels/food) continues to be a good value in my book, i will continue coming...when it doesnt, i wont. Funny thing is, when i average how much i spend "per nut" (and yes, i actually did that just for fun the first couple of trips...i am at heart an accountant)...even with the high cost of airfare, it is about 25% of what i would pay in the states...not a bad deal...and the girls/LBs are 1000% better!

As a footnote, i have enjoyed my time in cambodia as well, but it lacks the ammenities of Pattaya (movies at The Avenue, a starbucks on every corner)...but still has its place when i crave a hemminway moment.

I was once a city boy (lived in New York City, Chicago, LA)...but now i prefer the laid-back feeling of a beach/resort town like pattaya...i know its not ritzy, but thats ok, i dont want that, i get that at home, i want the casual...somewhat rough around the edges feel pattaya has...suits me just fine. I will continue to come to Pattaya for as long as it suits me, and when it doesnt i wont...and im sure it will not notice my absence then, just as it did not before i discovered it...the world will continue to turn as i seek out the next p4p market that suits me...ah yes, supply and demand...its a great regulator!

Long winded, but there you go...Cheers!

[paultain]

Other than the €˜Hotel room activities', when I see the likes of Bill69, taking 3 LB's to Koh Larn for the day makes me smile. I do this regularly, I've been known to take 4-6 LB's/GG'S/ or mixed to Koh Larn, weather or not I've shagged them or not, or probably never will.

Walking past and ignoring the ticket touts on the pier selling tickets at 200 baht per person for the ferry, and simply board the same ferry and pay 20 baht per person. Arriving at Koh Larn and all piling into a tuk tuk and head for the quietest beach there. The old beach shack, with the family renting out the deck chairs, selling a bit of food and cold drinks. Calling the owner over by his first name, and requesting certain dishes that is not on his menu, knowing well he will send his son on the motor cycle to market to get fresh supplies, for those dishes.

Having a chat with the owner about the usual things, while the girls are busy having fun with hide the bikini top, until mid-day when the meals arrive, setting the tables and deck chairs together, and we all dig in. As the meals are not on the menu, therefore no prices. I always make sure that it is clear to the owner, he can charge as much as he likes. A good and honest man he is, at the end of the day the bill always hovered around 800 baht. Host times I think he was not charging enough, so I would round it off to a thousand. After all he does have a family to feed.

Taking off from the beach, about an hour or two before the last ferry back to Patt's, right beside the pier where the ferry is birthed, I pile my companions into my mate's bar, right beside the pier. His name is John, an English man, with a few shabby rooms, a few pool tables and a bar. He tends to cater to the back-packers, more than anything. He is sometimes referred to as €˜Crazy John'. He's a bit of a piss head, but you couldn't meet a more genuine bloke. Married to an ex-ago go dancer, back in the 80's, and when she gets drink in her, she is crazy as a cute.

Back in the 80's, John and his wife used to wheel a little Bamberger stall at night and park it on whatever beer bar complex that was doing good business, and basically just surviving. We all use to laugh at them from time to time. As some nights they were doing well, they might buy the odd bottle of something, or the punters in the beer bars sending them over some drinks. And eventually they would get pissed up, then the argument starts. All hell breaks loose, till he's standing across the road, getting everything but the stall itself thrown at him. Or him running down the street, with her after him with a pair of barbeque thongs in her hand.

This carried on until he got badly run over by a car escaping his wife, and was nearly killed. They had to actually wire the poor sod back together again. Luckily for him the guy who ran him down, was another farang which was fully insured by a foreign company, and when it was found it was the drivers fault, the company paid out no problem. I think he got around 200,000 baht, more or less half that paid the hospital and the rest went to start a little guest house on Koh Larn.

Getting back to sitting with him, having a drink with my companions, waiting for the last ferry, his wife would be telling my companions, crazy stories and jokes. Actually she's quite a comedian, and would constantly keep them all in fits of laughter.

Sometimes, when we call in, his wife is no where to be seen. And when I ask John where is she he would go, "Ah, she was on the piss again last night, whet into one of her tantrums, threaten to kill herself, and jumped off the pier (the bar is built on the pier)". So I asked him how is she, and he would say, "The silly bitch was so drunk, she forgot the tide was out, and hit the rocks and broke her arm (the drop was no more than 2 meters, but the rocks are very sharp)". Other times she would break a leg, rib, or a pretty good sized gash.

But his wife would entertain my companions, with these events without shame, and in a hilarious and comical manner. And then I might get a whisper in my ear from one or two of them, "How you know these people? I think these people are good but a little crazy." I would answer; "They not think straight when they are maow, same, same everybody when they maow. And they are poor and my friends, so I will not pass them, and must give a little business to them when I can, and help them a little."

The sun is almost down, and the horn from the last ferry is blasting, and 45 minutes later we are all back to shore on Pattaya, and maybe I am keeping one of the six, but you can see the other 5 are on a downer in their eyes. They have to plod along back to their bars, but not forgetting a good day out full of fun, laughter, and more importantly, friendship. And all for the price of a ST in some cases.

Oh, and Merry Christmas to you all.

[jimslim]

Good to see the ladyboy philanthropists are still spreading their magic

[kahuna]

(jimslim @ Dec. 26 2008,02:13) Good to see the ladyboy philanthropists are still spreading their magic  

And so are the others are just speading their shit...?

[jimslim]

I was refering to our whaffling friend who started the thread

[69billy]

There are few BS..ers about....

[paultain]

rxpharm post 5;
"If the punter who pays 1500 Baht treats her nicely, you can be sure she will have more respect for that customer than one who pays 500 Baht and treats her poorly."

Answer;Well I thought that was nicely worded to suit your argument. It could have read the other way also " If the punter who pays 500 Baht treats her nicely, you can be sure she will have more respect for that customer than one who pays 1500 Baht and treats her poorly.

rxpharm post 5;
"As for whether or not punters who pay more than that have money to burn - what is your basis for that?"

Answer;I read the whole forum, that's my basis!

rxpharm post 5;
"How do you know what punters spend when they are back in their home countries?"

Answer;I don't recall mentioning anything about that, and will not as it is irrelevant, when I enter Thailand, I lock all the things of the outside world safely away.

rxpharm post 5;
"Exactly why do you consider those who pay 500 Baht ST and 1000 Bath LT heroes?"

Answer;I don't recall mentioning any particular sums of money as payment for sex.

rxpharm post 5;
"I draw your attention to the fact that 69billy also does more things with the lbs he likes than just the bedroom activities. He's taken some of them for various outings, and even paid to have teeth done for one, so it isn't just only 500 Baht ST or 1000 Baht LT."

Answer;That's right! But the likes of Billy and I had to pay in the region of 2000 - 6000, there wouldn't be much left to treat a few LB's on various outings, or help them out when they really need it. I guess we would have to mope around the hotel room waiting for the sun to go down.

rxpharm post 5;
"Do you think that the costs on Thailand have stayed the same for the past 15 years and the cost of living has not increased for the Thais? Does that justify in your mind to keep paying the same rates as 15 years ago?"

Answer;15 years ago, a ST was 200-300 baht, and a LT was 500 baht. And as I left Thailand 15 years ago, and spending 2-3 months per year to date, now how do you figure I am out of touch?

When I go back to Thailand I call in on all my old friends, farang and Thai business owners, and not gust in the sex trade. We always discuss the subject of wages, and as an employer for 15 years I certainly know what the minimum wage was then, and I certainly know what the minimum wage is now. Do you?

As a matter of fact, can you tell me what the minimum wage was based on in Thailand?

[paultain]

Another pic