9/11 Conspiracy? Or did we get the truth?

[Stewart]

http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...w/1227842.html

Including the reasons for the building 7 collapse

[JaiDee]

Yups, I mentioned PM early on ..... I love it whenever one of the ''9/11 truthers'' [ A great name for a group if there ever was one!] is asked about the Popular Mechanics stories, and they just continue to believe in their whacked out conspiracies; all the while "Loose Change" {the movie which started the conspiracy talk in the first place } has been edited and done over 3 times because of the story Stewart quotes here!

[Guest]

its all false, it happened but it wasnt muslim terrorists.
it was two irish builders on the 44th floor,
they were fitting door, and when it would fit paddy told murphy to go get a plane and take a bit off the top.


steviep

[whore]

There is too much evidence pointing in all directions to come up with an answer. I agree with what some of you's say that the Bush administration would be too stupid to plan and conceal something like this, but thats judging a book by its cover. George Bush was the face of that administration and he came across as a complete idiot. But what about those behind him, what about guys in the Pentagon you know nothing about. Someone said, might have been Jaidee, that "no" witnesses has came forward to say, someone down this, someone done that and that it would take thousands to pull it off. That again is not true. It wouldnt take thousands of people to do something like this. Like if it really was just terrorists involved, do you think it was thousands more then the just 19 hijackers involved.

Here is a video of a guy called David Ray Griffin who wrote a book about Bin Laden and claims that he died in december 2001 from kidney failure, yet numerous videos have been "intercepted" by the CIA of Bin Laden after is supposed time of death, and the post 2001 Bin Laden looks nothing like the man you see in years of earlier footage of him, and only in these newer videos he actually claims that Al Qaida done 9/11. He even praised the people who done it in one of his pre december 2001 videos as if he didnt know who done it, but was happy to see the US attacked.

Another interesting video is footage of BBC reporting that world trade centre 7 collapsed due to structural damage. The reporter on the scene was saying it had collasped 20 minutes before it had and even funnier they were saying this with the building still standing in the backround.

There is too many questions about this that will never be answered and colussion between governments and terrorists isnt something new. The Irish and British governments done it all the time during the troubles here.

[Torurot]

Many things go on in the military, CIA, Blackwater etc that the "government" knows little to nothing, and probably do not "officially" approve of. "Conspiracy" of silence, how long did it take for the bombing of Laos & Cambodia by the US to come out. Last year nuclear bombs were loaded onto a B52 and flown over America against all "protocols". This was not supposed to happen, and the base commander said he didn't know. It only came to light due to a low level grunt leaking it.

The Bush admin didn't drop the towers but they did nothing to stop them either. Where's all the Gold from building 7?

911 was planned in Germany, Saudi Arabia, and the USA, not Iraq, Iran or Afghanistan.

Why is the US in Afghanistan, Iraq? Afghanistan and Iraq did nothing to the USA. You know the answer to "why do 'they' hate us".

[PigDogg]

(Stewart @ Oct. 22 2009,07:59) Including the reasons for the building 7 collapse

Worked at 7 WTC for five years.

My company moved out in May 2001, lucky move.

[Torurot]

Here's some tucker for the conspiracy trolls

"John Farmer, Dean of the Law School at Rutgers University and former Attorney General of New Jersey, was legal counsel to the 9/11 Commission, and in charge of drafting its report. Now, having read through lots of further evidence, he's come to the conclusion that the official version of the story is almost entirely untrue, and is based on false testimony by the White House, CIA, FBI and NORAD.

His new book, The Ground Truth: The Story Behind America's Defense on 9/11, makes this case with loads of documentary evidence€“and his colleagues on the commission are on board, as the article below makes clear.

So are John Farmer and those other members of that very commission all "conspiracy theorists"? Here's the press release re: Farmer's book from Rutgers University:

http://news.rutgers.edu/medrel/news-...-book-by-dean- joh-20090908 "


and


The 9/11 Commission Rejects own Report as Based on Government Lies

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/s...ruth_9-11-09.p hp

(CINCINNATI, Ohio) €“ In John Farmer's book: "The Ground Truth: The Story Behind America's Defense on 9/11?, the author builds the

inescapably convincing case that the official version... is almost entirely untrue... The 9/11 Commission now tells us that the official version of 9/11 was based on false testimony and documents and is almost entirely untrue.

The details of this massive cover-up are carefully outlined in a book by John Farmer, who was the Senior Counsel for the 9/11 Commission. Farmer, Dean of Rutger Universities' School of Law and former Attorney General of New Jersey, was responsible for drafting the original flawed 9/11 report.

Does Farmer have cooperation and agreement from other members of the Commission? Yes.

Did they say Bush ordered 9/11? No.

Do they say that the 9/11 Commission was lied to by the FBI, CIA, Whitehouse and NORAD? Yes.

Is there full documentary proof of this? Yes.

Farmer states..."at some level of the government, at some point in timeÅ there was an agreement not to tell the truth about what happened... I was shocked at how different the truth was from the way it was described Å . The [Norad air defense] tapes told a radically different story from what had been

told to us and the public for two years. This is not spin."

The 9/11 Commission head, Thomas Kean, was the Republican governor of New Jersey. He had the following to say... "We to this day don't know why

NORAD [the North American Aerospace Command] told us what they told us, it was just so far from the truth. . . "

When Bush's own handpicked commission failed to go along with the cover up and requested a criminal investigation, why was nothing done? 9/11

Commission member and former US Senator, Bob Kerrey, says, "No one is more qualified to write the definitive book about the tragedy of 9/11

than John Farmer. Fortunately, he has done so. Even more fortunately the language is clear, alive and instructive for anyone who wants to

make certain this never happens again."

With the only "official" 9/11 report now totally false, where do we go from here? Who is hurt by these lies? The families of the victims of 9/11 have fought, for years, to get to the truth. For years, our government has hidden behind lies and secrecy to deny them closure. In 2006, The Washington Post reported..."Suspicion of wrongdoing ran so deep that the 10-member commission, in a secret meeting at the end of its tenure in summer 2004, debated referring the matter to the Justice Department for criminal investigation, according to several commission sources.

Staff members and some commissioners thought that e-mails and other evidence provided enough probable cause to believe that military and aviation officials violated the law by making false statements to Congress and to the commission..."

What does Farmer's book tell us? Farmer offers no solutions, only a total and full rejection of what was told and his own his own ideas

concerning the total failure of honesty on the part of the government, a government with something to hide.

Farmer never tells us what. Nobody could keep a job in the public sector speaking out more than Farmer has.

What were Farmer's omissions?

There are some. Now that we know that intelligence given the 9/11 Commission wasn't just lies from our own government but based on testimony coerced through torture from informants forced to back up a cover story now proven false, a pattern emerges. We know that, immediately after 9/11, many more potential suspects and informants were flown directly to Saudi Arabia (and Israel €“ Ed.) by Presidential order than were ever detained and questioned. We will never know what they could have said. Their testimony would have been vital to any real investigation were they not put beyond the reach of even Congress and the FBI.

Putting aside all other questions of recent evidence of CIA involvement with bin Laden prior to 9/11 or altered physical evidence involving the Pentagon attack, any failure to call to account the systematic perjury committed by dozens of top government officials, now exposed as a certainty is an offense to every American.

We now know with certainty that we were lied to, not in a minor way, but systematically as part of a plot covering up government involvement at nearly every level, perhaps gross negligence, perhaps something with darker intent.

Are we willing to live with another lie to go with the Warren Report, Iran Contra and so many others? Has the sacrifice of thousands more Americans, killed, wounded or irreparably damaged by a war knowingly built on the same lies from the same liars who misled the 9/11 Commission pushed us beyond willingness to confront the truth? Have we yet found where the lies have begun and ended? There is no evidence of this, only evidence to the contrary. The lies live on and the truth never sought.

The courage for that task has not been found.

By the way, lying to congress is a felony -possible penalty-up to 5-8 years in prison. SEE:

18 U.S.C. § 1001 : US Code €“ Section 1001: Statements or entries

generally ( http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/47/1001) €“Sam

[pacman]

(Torurot @ Oct. 23 2009,05:09) Are we willing to live with another lie to go with the Warren Report...

    The Warren Report is a lie?

But JaiDee said it was the truth, he said it explained JFK's assassination so completely that RFK & Jackie were both convinced by its findings.

Will someone tell me just what truth the establishment are hiding over 9/11. What have they done that it must be concealed from the American public at any cost?

53 members of the Bin Laden family were collected & flown out of the US within 24 hours of 9/11 while there was a blanket flight ban in place. Why were they given such privileged protection?

That the US is beholden to the Saudi royal family should come as a surprise to no one. But what is the nature of the relationship between the CIA & Bin Laden? Should Bin Laden ever be captured, something that could be achieved quickly if they seriously wanted to, he would have to be shot on sight.

His testimony would prove very damaging to the US & their interests. Plus shock the public by revealing the secret side of US/Saudi relations.

[strocube]

(Torurot @ Oct. 23 2009,05:09) Here's some tucker for the conspiracy trolls

"John Farmer, Dean of the Law School at Rutgers University and former Attorney General of New Jersey, was legal counsel to the 9/11 Commission, and in charge of drafting its report. Now, having read through lots of further evidence, he's come to the conclusion that the official version of the story is almost entirely untrue, and is based on false testimony by the White House, CIA, FBI and NORAD.

http://news.rutgers.edu/medrel/news-...-book-by-dean- joh-20090908   "

and

The 9/11 Commission Rejects own Report as Based on Government Lies

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/s...ruth_9-11-09.p hp

Holy fuck, dude, well posted.  

[alan1chef]

There is no doubt that we got the truth about the attacks themselves. As for Charlie Sheen...I think he has been smoking his clothes.

I am not in the least surprised about the discrepancies in the 9/11 Commission report. I am also not surprised that someone from that Commission would write a book about it, embellishing at every turn in an attempt to sell books.

Wherein lies the truth? Somewhere in between the lies, the rhetoric and the exaggerations. However, I'm glad that the government lied to the Commission. The Commission overstepped their authority.

Do you think it is really necessary for the American government to open it's files on counter intelligence activities to public scrutiny while the rest of the world keeps secrets? Are you naive enough to think that America is the only country in the world to engage in counter intelligence? America has to reveal it's secrets while everyone else does not....is that the new international rules of engagement?

[Torurot]

>>53 members of the Bin Laden family were collected & flown out of the US within 24 hours of 9/11 while there was a blanket flight ban in place. Why were they given such privileged protection? >>

Rarely mentioned, a number of Israelis where also spirited out of the country. For what reason?? Out of reach of USA "justice", as neither Israel or Saudi have extradition treaties with the "infidel".

Just because you believe in conspiracy doesn't mean "they" are not out to get you.

[strocube]

(Torurot @ Oct. 23 2009,13:39) >>53 members of the Bin Laden family were collected & flown out of the US within 24 hours of 9/11 while there was a blanket flight ban in place. Why were they given such privileged protection? >>

Rarely mentioned, a number of Israelis where also spirited out of the country.  For what reason??   Out of reach of USA "justice", as neither Israel or Saudi have extradition treaties with the "infidel".

Just because you believe in conspiracy doesn't mean "they" are not out to get you.  

Exactly, it seems that the implied idea here is that anyone who dares to question the official government line is automatically deemed a tin foil hat waring paranoid psycho cretin.
DON"T THINK, BELIEVE!

For me, just the way that these events were spun as pretext for invading and occupying Iraq is more than enough to create a serious doubt in my mind as to the veracity of the government's claims in regard to 9/11.
We were and continue being lied to.

[JaiDee]

(strocube @ Oct. 24 2009,02:33) these events were spun as pretext for invading and occupying Iraq

Now THAT part I will agree with!

But it happened after the fact, man.....  Bushie and pals used  9/11 to say "we have to get Saddam, he was tied into all this'' and it was convenient for them to do so because so much rabid fervor was being raised in the US against terrorists at that time, you know.....

 Before the fact, the simple matter was that it was just some crazy dude with a chip on his shoulder against western ideals and a ton of cash, as well as a way- too- strict interpretation of the K'oran, basically reading it as ALL enemies of Islam must be struck dead from the earth.  He planned it, his followers carried it out, same as they did the USS Cole and Tanzania and Kenyan embassies, and he was successful; amazing, really.  Then the warmongers in power in DC at the time could use him and Al-Qaeda to start a middle eastern war, dragging Iraq into it 2 years later.

[Guest]

(Stewart @ Oct. 22 2009,22:59) http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...w/1227842.html

Including the reasons for the building 7 collapse

So you rely on a magazine that has an article on their debunking of 9/11 between their articles on monster trucks and Naascar gear?

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/gopm/index.html

They always bring in the experts from popular mechanics......to funny. Why them were mythbusters busy with another show?

[Guest]

fIRST OF ALL,I believe that 4 planes were hijacked by 19 muslim extremists and flew 2 of those planes into the twin towers.The buildings collapsed,and the collapses looked like controlled demolitions(but that doent mean they were)The one i have a problem with is the one that( is supposed to have) hit the Pentagon.The HQ of the military wing of the only superpower,and no cctv cameras to record the strike?The initial entrance hole looked too small considering it was hit by an airliner.Has anyone seen fotographic evidence of debris strewn around the pentagon?Any dead bodies lying around?Perhaps it was a missile that hit the pentagon(claimed the French secret service)and the airplane was shot down on the orders of Cheney before it reached the pentagon.I have no problem with that,but its the cover up that causes conspiracies.Lack of transparency by goverment/obvious lying is what causes conspiracies,so where are the fotos of the plane hitting the pentagon?Finally,no way could that borderline retard have anything do do with any conspiracy /cover up-he's just too stupid.