Goodbye America...

[mister_smith]

The only reason the Chinese economy is growing is because European and American consumers are buying all thier goods, When a recession really starts to bite and people stop buying what are you left with then? Factories full of stuff they can't sell.

If the consumer economies go into a recession the producing economies follow

[bbb2k2]

I guess some yanks have lived off their credit card too long. Too bad it brings the rest of the world down too.

It used to be "the best country in the world" just 20 years ago, but today it's WAY down on the list. It's not longer the biggest economy in the world and it will probably be passed by China and India in 10+ years time too.

[stogie bear]

(buttafly @ Mar. 21 2008,00:45) can we get that smilie for this board?? it's pretty cool .....and where is the Canuck flag??

For the Canadian smiley simply type in...

CODE[/quote]

:can:[/quote]



Takes but a second and you have it!

As for that guillotine monstrosity - I'll assume you are kidding!

[pacman]

The American economy is going over the cliff as we speak.

It is no longer a case of whether the US Fed can save it, it is a case of just how severe & how long the recession is going to be.
It's already started but all Govts are notoriously slow in acknowleging any downturn.

Interestingly, I assumed their problems stemmed from the sub-prime credit crisis, but it has its roots back in the 90's when Clinton, desperate to avoid a recession on his watch, authorised Greenspan to inject massive amounts of funds into the system.
i.e. he created billions of dollars out of thin air, which in turn finished up fueling the dot com boom, then when that collapsed the banks had such massive funds that had to be put somewhere, thus the cycle started again, & they lent it out in the form of mortgages.

After all, property is gilt-edged right, at least you have something to show for it, unlike worthless share scrip.
Wrong, not when you lend it out to anyone, borrowers were told to lie, so desperate were these bastards to park their funds.

In the worst case of corporate immorality imaginable, the banks realised they were going to have a problem collecting their dough from the poor saps who were suckered into taking on these unrealistic debts,
so they collateralised good debt with shit & flogged it off around the world.
Thus burning the very people they will be looking to help them.
The worst offender in all of this is the Citi Group, proud owners of the world's largest bankrupt bank.

Conservative estimates put their obligations at half a trillion US$ but it is more in the region of 1 to 2 trillion.
And to prove just what fine, upstanding chaps they are, with much of this sub-prime shit they signed guarantees. Completely illegally, so new jails will need to be built to accomodate all the culpable executives.

And if you doubt that Citi is bankrupt, they had to flog off 4.5% to the middle east for 7.5 billion just to meet immediate cash requirements. That was only after one of the most senior execs of the Fed took a mid-night flight to "talk them into it".
Imagine the deal the arabs were able to get!
I read they are being paid 11% p.a. interest.

By who?

And once that was spent, Citi had to tell their major clients they can't withdraw any money. They straight out don't have it.
They are just one of 3 or 4 (or more) major banks that are completely fucked right now.

Of course these institutions can't be allowed to collapse, thus Ben Bernanke will have to start printing more money again.
The really scary bit is the massive sub-prime problem is not going away & with every day passing it is becoming increasingly clear the Federal Reserve will need to monetarise all that debt.
i.e. assume responsibility for it & extend Govt money to the banks so they have some hope of trading out of it.

That will ensure the collapse of the US dollar, but to do nothing will be worse.
This is not going to take 10 years, not even 5, but when the effects start to bite, the world will never have witnessed such a site as a major power collapsing overnight.

And they only have their stupidity to blame. And greed.

[vangough05]

I always wondered how easy it was for me to get a Citbank Gold Credit. Obviously they give them out if you ask nicely

[allstar88]

you have always got your health

[daveduke007]

Where's America ? 

[Torurot]

Pacman, Those sick fuck parasitic wide boys in the financial sector will not spend ONE night in jail. They made their commissions, took the money & ran, screwing the entire economy in the process and the US government bails the banks at the cost of Mr & Mrs everybody. "Capitalism" at it's worse. Follow the money! They still have it.

[batman4ever]

(terryw @ Mar. 20 2008,03:15) The UK is self sufficient in the production of oil yet we are paying about $9 usd for a gallon of petrol (gas).

We have the highest prices in Europe due to taxation and Government policy is to keep increasing these so called green taxes. About 85% of the price of a gallon is taxation.

Its probably 20 years since we were paying the equivalent of $4 usd for a gallon of gas.

iam not sure youre right...

right now in Denmark we pay more than 1 pound per LITRE...
and regarding tax...well i pay more than 68% of my higher part of income...

[allstar88]

lets all go to india and china and open fish n chip shops

[buttafly]

(bbb2k2 @ Mar. 21 2008,04:50) It used to be "the best country in the world" just 20 years ago

I remember for years telling people I was a yank and then getting awe-inspired looks and follow-up questions, especially in 3rd-world hellholes like  Vietnam and Cambo and Indonesia,  et al .....   even pre- Euro -Union countries would look at the states and think how well we were doing and hell, many  generations of Euro's came here to start a better life for 200+ years.

 Now....thanks to president Cheney and his buddies .... we are the laughing stocks of the world and when I was in  Europe last summer I was kind of ashamed to even admit where I come from. "hey, you talk kinda funny laddie, where are ye from??''

  Ontario  

[allstar88]

dont get down you yanks always bounce back stogie just likes to look at the negatives in life

[bigmick22]

(allstar88 @ Mar. 21 2008,13:36) lets all go to india and china and open fish n chip shops

hell, let's go to China and make some ladyboys!

[dummy_plug]

First off, the USA is still the largest economy in the world, and by a far margin. I don't subscribe to this crap about a faux country called the "Euro Zone" and neither should you.

Second, China is a far larger economy than India's (FY06 it is about 2.5x the size) and has posted consistently higher growth rates than its smaller neighbor for the last 15-20 years. BOTH of them will continue to grow in terms of scale and importance to the global community and BOTH will feel impacts if there is a global slowdown (note: yes the US and Europe buy most of China's factory output, but who the hell do you think outsources call centers and IT support to India???). Economics is not a zero sum game - just because China grows doesn't mean India or any other country can't too. Brazil is also a game-changer in the fact that it too is getting richer and more important as a global market, but out of the BRIC nations I'd rank them last in terms of their prospects in the next 20-30 years.

Third, while everyone seems to crow about the US's apparent (and foregone) demise - albeit only after watching soundbites from CNN from the last six months, I don't think there is a credible economist or financial policy maker in the world that doesn't think that is a cyclic downturn. Yes, there are serious problems today in the American economy, but fundamentally its sound. This is not the first time there has been dire economic events, but you only need look to history to see that this country has been able to weather the downturns and emerge stronger than before. Things always go up and down. It wasn't long ago when Europeans lamented the strong dollar and the weak Euro...

As the most powerful and economically prosperous nation, I'd expect the USA to get a few kicks to the face when its down (as this has always occurred in the past). But don't worry, when the next cycle hits and the swing of power has turned in America's favor, I'm sure it will remember to do the same.

[alan1chef]

Thank you for interjecting some sense into this thread of nonsense. American politicians have a habit of trying to take credit and avoiding blame for every economic upturn and downturn that has occurred throughout our history. The truth is...they have little to do with either event.