New Constitution to recognize LB rights

[rxpharm]

Another update to this story, a new group has been started to promote transgender recognition in Thailand. The group is called Transgender Women in Thailand. If you can read Thai, here is the homepage: Transgender Women in Thailand

Miss Alcazar 2005 (Nok) has quit the Venus Flytrap singing group and is spending more time with Transgender Women in Thailand, and trying to promote the passage of the law that will allow transgenders to change their titles.

[Road Runner]

Hello Rxpharm,

Thanks for the link  -  I've e-mailed it to Herself. First I have to get her to read it.
After that I have to get her to put her head above the parapet and make herself known.

She's acquired the British cynicsm about politicians from me.
But as yet she has not understood either that it's her duty to complain to her representative when things are wrong or the Anglo-Saxon concept that throwing (unpleasant) objects at inept or incompetant officials is her right.

RR.

[rxpharm]

RR you're welcome! The only way things will ever improve for lbs in Thailand is by organizing, lobbying and publicizing themselves. Transgender Women in Thailand is one group that may have a chance of doing something.

I hope that Herself will get involved!

[Road Runner]

(rxpharm @ Oct. 24 2007,15:31) The only way things will ever improve for lbs in Thailand is by organizing, lobbying and publicizing themselves.

But first they will have to get out of bed in the morning!

RR.

[moe666]

Out of bed early, I thought sleeping in was enshrined in the Thai Constitution.

[terryw]

I spoke to my gf about this today and she made these observations.

Firstly, if her Thai ID card had Ms or F for female on it then it would make no difference because Thai people can recognise the vast majority of ladyboys.

Secondly, she would be happy if she could have a female identity on her passport. Last March she had a minor problem with HK immigration and she doesn't want the same problem to happen at Manchester when she visits the UK next year.

Finally, she has no interest joining a Transgender Rights group because she is too busy trying to earn a living.

[rxpharm]

It is true that most lbs are thinking about day to day things, but right now - they cannot legally marry, they have difficulty traveling with passports that have "M", a man can rape them without worrying of being charged for it, etc.

I think if she really wants to know what difference it can make she can contact the group - and see what they are trying to do.

If she does that, then she can make a decision based on facts instead of conjecture if she wants to get involved or not.

Thanks for sharing!

[Road Runner]

Hello Terryw,

Yes your girl friend is entirely right about the ID cards. Herself (my girlfriend) has tried various means to get hers changed  -  unsucessfully.

Similarly she's right about the passports. Herself's plan is to get UK citizenship and get the sex on her passport changed that way.
Believe me UK immigration have always treated Herself with great tact so I doubt that you girlfriend will have a problem at Manchester.

I can understand why she has no interest in joining a transgender group. Herself has said the same thing.

What will they gain from doing so?  In the short term and with the present political situation in Thailand  -  nothing! In the long term?  Very little!

But...... there just might be a chance that they can change things for the 5-6 years olds that at this time are wondering why they really don't feel that they are boys.  Or girls.

RR.

[rxpharm]

Here is an article from the October 01, 2007 issue of Outlook from the Bangkok Post. Unfortunately the proposed law was not passed before the election. The process likely has to start from the beginning again. It will also be near the bottom of the priority list for the new government. Changes will probably not be happening anytime in the near future.

Are you man enough to be a woman? By Sanitsuda Ekachai

THAILAND: A group of politicians is drafting a bill that will legally recognise male-to-female transsexuals as women

Twice Pakjira sailed through interviews and was told she had got the job. Twice they called her back to tell her she hadn't. Their reason was similar€”head office does not want to hire katoey, or transsexuals.

Like Pakjira, Yolada has undergone gender reassignment surgery so she can live as a woman. However, even with beauty queen looks and a feminine voice, she still could not find a job.

Tired of being turned down, Yolada applied for a bank loan so she could start her own business. The answer from the bank was a big "No!"

"Not only because my legal documents do not match my gender, but also because they believe katoey in general are unreliable," she recalled bitterly.

Ask male-to-female transsexuals about the discrimination they face, and stories of pain and anguish flow freely.

When facing the draft, for example, the military has until very recently branded transsexuals as "permanently damaged by mental sickness", and thus unfit for military service. This labelling affects their jobs prospects for life.

Thanks to campaigns by human rights activists, the military is amending ministerial regulations and exempting trans-sexuals from the draft. In the interim, the military has promised not to label transsexuals as mentally ill, but it admits that it is difficult to alter past draft documents.

When attempting to travel abroad, transsexuals are often refused entry to foreign countries, and can be treated badly by immigration officers. When sick, hospital staff often simply place them on men's wards. If arrested, they are commonly sent to men's prisons, which is tantamount to being sentenced to molestation and rape.

In everyday life, transsexuals find themselves targets of ridicule and harassment. The lack of job opportunities also forces many of them to earn a living in the sex industry, even if well-educated.

"Society is still very much indifferent to our problems," said Suttirat Simsiriwong, a transsexual who made headlines a few months ago when the Novotel Hotel refused her entry to its club on the grounds of her being a katoey.

Although after a boycott and a campaign by gay rights groups the hotel finally issued an apology, Suttirat said living a normal life will remain difficult for transsexuals as long as the law refuses to allow them to change their titles and names to match their chosen gender.

That is why so many jumped for joy when the National Legislative Assembly's Committee on Women announced it would sponsor a bill to help make their dreams come true.

The move came after the much-publicised case of Suttirat, which exposed politicians to the discrimination faced by transsexuals and the need to legally recognise sexual diversity and gay rights.

According to Dr Juree Vichid-Vadakarn, chair of the NLA's sub-committee on women, male-to-female transsexuals will benefit from the bill, which is in line with constitutional rights of gender equality.

At present, men can use the title Nai (mister) before and after marriage. Unmarried women, however, use Nangsao (miss), while married women must use Nang (missus), even after divorce.

This requirement has caused problems to many married women when they do business or enter contracts, because as married women they must provide proof of the official approval of their spouses. Divorced women must always make their divorce papers available when entering into contracts.

The draft bill, said Juree, will strike a balance by allowing married women to continue using Nangsao or Ms, although those who prefer to use Nang or Mrs may do so.

Male-to-female transsexuals, according to the draft bill, will have the same rights regarding titles as genetic women€”they will be able to use Nangsao and the authorities must issue them with new ID cards showing their new gender, and change their other legal documents accordingly.

However, despite high hopes, the draft bill does not look like it will enjoy a smooth passage.

"From my experience as a lawmaker, the most difficult legislation to pass through Parliament is that dealing with gender, because it touches on people's deep-rooted cultural values and prejudices," said Wallop Tangkunanurak, chair of the NLA's Committee on Women.

"These laws are generally considered very low priority and almost always held up until Parliament is almost over. More often than not, they do not make it in time."

That might be the case with this new bill€”the government and agencies involved can ask for time for detailed scrutiny of its contents, and fierce opposition from the conservative Interior Ministry is certain. The process could drag on until the NLA is dissolved after a new government and Senate are elected.

While some politicians are sympathetic, others remain fiercely resistant.

"They've expressed concerns that allowing transsexuals to use the title 'Miss' will enable them to trick men into a marriage," Wallop said. "They also asked if men 'tricked' into marriage, when they discover their new wife is transgendered and cannot have children, will be able to file for divorce."

To speed up the legislative process and lessen opposition, the Committee on Women believes it is best to allow only those who have undergone gender reassignment surgery to change their names and titles.

But this proposal has led to a split in the transsexual community.

"Those who have gender reassignment surgery are only a tiny minority, because the surgery is very costly," said Sitthiphan Boonyapisomparn, a social worker from Sisters, a counselling centre for transsexuals in Pattaya.

"If the law benefits only this small group, it will be discriminating against those of us who don't have the financial means to have the surgery."

Many male-to-female transsexuals, she added, prefer not to have surgery because they are afraid of the long-term effects on their health. Stories also abound of complications and health consequences, which deter many trans-sexuals from having gender reassignment surgery.

It is also feared that allowing only those who undergo gender reassignment surgery to change their documentation may encourage young transsexuals to seek the operation before they really understand their sexual identity.

"When I was young, my dream was to have a sex change operation," recalled gay rights activist Natee Thirarojanapruek. "I would have regretted it for life had I done so, because I later found out that I am a gay queen, not a transsexual."

Their concerns are also echoed by Naiyana Supapueng, a National Human Rights Commissioner.

"The law cannot be discriminatory on socio-economic grounds," she explained. "Transsexuals who have had gender reassignment surgery, and those who have not, face the same problems. It's discriminatory to help only those who can afford surgery."

It is also not right to push transsexuals who do not need surgery to go through such a complicated procedure just because they see it as the only way to change their identity, she added. "This will end up only benefiting the medical businesses," she noted.

But Yolada Suanyot, in her capacity as leader of the TG Thailand campaign group, believes it is the most practical solution, given society's strong scepticism of transgender women, to make those who have had gender reassignment surgery top priority in obtaining legal gender identity.

"We have to tackle change step-by-step," said Yollada, who won the Miss Alcazar transsexual beauty pageant in 2005.

As for premature decisions to have surgery, this problem can be solved by ensuring patients undergo a thorough psychological and physical examination, which is already standard practice in state hospitals, she explained.

But such examinations are not always given in highly commercialised private hospitals, noted Naiyana.

There is also a need to study what other countries have done to help resolve transsexuals' gender identity problems, to chart the best course for local policies, she stressed.

To start with, it is now accepted that transsexuals suffer from gender identity disorder, a problem that can be medically corrected by hormonal treatment and gender reassignment surgery.

According to Prof Douglas Sanders, a visiting lecturer at Chulalongkorn and Mahidol Universities, the European Court of Justice ruled in 1996 that discrimination on the basis of gender reassignment was discrimination on the basis of sex, thus contrary to EU law.

In 2002, the European Court of Human Rights ruled that post-operative transsexuals are entitled to have personal documentation, including birth certificates, drivers' licences and passports changed to reflect their gender identity.

In 2003, the same court also ruled that gender reassignment surgery was a legitimate medical procedure, and not elective plastic surgery, and should be covered by health insurance. Consequently, all EU countries are required to have laws consistent with these rulings.

It is now routine in countries including Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the US and some South American countries, to alter the document of post-operative transsexuals, he said.

This year Brazil set another standard by ruling that gender reassignment surgery must be provided free of charge.

Asia is fast following the trend. China, Indonesia, Japan, Singapore and South Korea have now recognised post-operative transsexuals' rights to have their personal documents changed.

"In the Muslim world, the change is recognised in Egypt, Indonesia, Iran and Turkey, but not in Malaysia," he added.

Each country's recognition of transsexual gender identity differs, however. In Germany, the law allows changes to birth certificates only for those who undergo gender reassignment surgery, while the UK extends recognition to all cases where there has been a diagnosis of gender identity disorder and where the individual is living in the desired sex.

"Genital surgery has its risks, and individuals should not be pressured into seeking surgery in order to gain recognition," he said, urging Thailand to follow the practice in the UK.

With pressures of time, strong resistance and divided opinions, Suttirat said she had little hope that society will listen to the voices of transsexuals.

"Our real battle is not about getting new identity cards," she said. "It's about how to make society understand that our being transgendered can be medically corrected, and that it is completely unjust to condemn us and dismiss us with oppressive stereotypes.

"On our part, transsexuals must also provide positive role models so society can look at us in a positive light, so that parents understand and stop beating and punishing children who are born transsexual.

"Our goal is to be treated equally, with dignity. The battle is a long one. But at least we can say the journey for our rights has begun."