BANGKOK or PATTAYA or PHUKET?

[johnnydiver]

I voted Pattaya because of the price. I loved Phuket and have not been to Bangkok. I am hooked at C & D's which will provide you with more than enough to play with! 40 plus girls! Yep, C & D's gets my vote for hotties but Pattaya gets it for numbers and price value.

[katoeylover]

(Steff @ Nov. 09 2010,19:58)
No, I'm stumped. Who?

Take a wild stab in the dark...

[iceberg]

BKK for the amount of LBs I did as a newbie in 3 nights was great.But I have to say that Pattaya was probably the best because i met a very special someone and ended up spending 2 weeks out of my 18 day 1st visit to LOS with so it will always be #1  in my mind becausee of all the good times we spent together,Phuket was cool and I ended up taking her there so it also added to my memories as a really cool place to go even though I didn't get to sample all the hot LB's in C&D meeting Jimbo was cool and my girl and i had a great time. So in closing if i have to vote Patts has it but just.

[pacman]

(kahuna @ Nov. 10 2010,01:03) For a real ladyboy adventure, Pattaya is indeed the place...Trust me, they're everywhere...

I concur with your entire post. The array of talent waiting to be discovered in Pattaya has to be seen to be believed. The fact that so many of these new LBs on the scene are next to useless in the bedroom is a subject for another thread but they are there in number.

While Bangkok is a busy, polluted city with endless traffic & a nicer spread of society, Pattaya is a polluted town by the water that exists for the sole purpose of supporting the 'adult' tourism industry. It serves little purpose other than a place for hotels, bars, clubs & girls.

As seedy as it is & as undesirable as some of the visitors are (all of us fine, upstanding gentlemen excepted), there is no other place quite like it.

With the Thais open acceptance about making money from the exploitation of their women, Pattaya is the perfect confluence of the poor offspring of Isaan (and other regions) & single men of the world. Much more so than other places.

Fortunately the question is where is better for ladyboys & not where is the nicest place for LBs. I won't defend my choice of Pattaya as being a nice place. It isn't, it is a place that serves its purpose & it works very well. I hope it survives the current slump because once the infrastructure gets too broken, it may never recover. Or more precisely, I doubt the authorities would allow it to go back to what it is.

And that would be tragic for everyone here on the forum. All that is, except Bumpa. He doesn't like Phuket either, I guess there's just no pleasing some folks...          

[PigDogg]

(kahuna @ Nov. 09 2010,10:03) For a real ladyboy adventure, Pattaya is indeed the place...Trust me, they're everywhere...

As an example, last night after dinner we were strolling home in an area that doesn't have beer bars and saw a costume rental store and was looking at the Loy Krathong outfits in the window.

Thais don't seem content to let farang to study menus or windowshop, so a young ladyboy came out to say hello.

There are thousands of ladyboys in Pattaya. Now I am sure there are more in Bangkok but per capita Pattaya wins easily for the number of ladyboys.

Think the reason for this is that Pattaya is an opportunity for ladyboys to earn more money than back home even if they don't want to work in a bar combined with the acceptance of Issan ladyboys in Sin City.

Perhaps worthy of it's onw thread I wonder how many ladyboys in Pattaya and my guess is somewhat close to five thousand, the exact number contingent on how one defines ladyboys.

As for the poll, I voted Pattaya , for sheer quantity of ladyboys and value for the money in Pattaya.

Of course Phuket has world class beaches and Bangkok is a cosmopolitan city with lots to offer

[mardhi]

I will come in and put the cat among the pidgeons LOL.      

I have found Pattaya of late has increased CONSIDERABLY in price to the point that IMHO its on a par with Bangkok these days.    The perception is that Pattaya is cheaper but given I live between the two cities and have done for 10 years - my view is that is no longer the case (and I am referring primarily to the LB focus, however general costs have also risen).

As an example,   Drink prices in most venues have been creeping up in Pattaya - they have been constant in BKK for the most part over the last couple of years.    Barfines are also increasing - what used to be 200b is now 500b, which is on a par with Bangkok.    A Heineken beer in KC3 or Guess Bar is 100b and its the same price in almost all LB venues in Pattaya.    A beer in Obsession or Cascades is 145b although there are no directly comparable venues in Pattaya albeit at a stretch Pattaya's Obsession is about as close as you could get to the volume of girls in the Top BKK venues.       There are plenty of 'low cost' non LB drinking holes in Bangkok but they are not as well known as the 'corner bar' etc in Sunee.     Place in Soi 6 for example next to the Dynasty Grande charges 60b from memory for a large Leo Beer - same as many street places around Pratunam

 Food prices are on a par except in the plethora of 'low cost dining venues' where Pattaya wins hands down - the amount of places you can get a good "english" breakfast is staggering.    5* dining is also cheaper in Pattaya than in BKK but the number of venues is considerably lower.    

Transport costs are on a par between the two cities - except in BKK meter Taxis are the norm and start at 35 baht meter fare.    The MINIMUM you can get a baht bus for is 100b and mostly its 150b now.    Equivalent fare in an aircon taxi in BKK would be 50-60b.    Motorbike taxis are on a par between the two cities.    

Hotel costs are now very similar - however in Pattaya you have a wider selection of low cost guesthouses.   Flip side to that though is that the selection of 'low cost rooms' is much wider around the Soi Bukow area than an equivalent in BKK for long stayers.    

An interesting debate for sure.     I am not up to date with Phuket prices as I have not been there for probably 8 years.    I found it considerably more expensive than BKK at that time but no idea what its like now and my focus was not on P4P pricing or indeed venues that long ago.    

Cheers
Mardhi

[mardhi]

What is also worth considering is the mix of venues. Some view it as a plus and others as a negative.

Bangkok has a huge concentration of LB's in two areas - namely Soi 4/nana and Patpong. Essentially all the P4P LB activity centres around these two areas. Thats good if you dont know the layout of a city as you simply dont need to - there are only two areas you need to know.

Pattaya has physically more venues albeit with much fewer staff. To amplify this point I would 'guesstimate' that in Cascade & Obsession combined - you have more LB's than in all the Pattaya dedicated venues put together. So its if you like the hypermarket of LB shopping versus the neighbourhood boutique shops

Thinking about it how do the numbers work out?

based on my own eye witness evidence of recent visits and general discussion on the forums.
Pattaya
JSB/England Bar 10
Linda Bar 8
Performance Bar 8
Ezy Bar 10
Famous Bar 12
Obsessions 20
Stringfellows 14
La Bamba 10
Koyo Bar 6
Pook Bar (combined as they keep flitting between the 2) 40
So What Bar 6
Lucky Love 6
Hi Boss 10
Naklua beer bars 10

So your at 170

Currently between Cascade and Obsession I would guestimate they are running on 180 staff combined (4 shifts of dancers each - normally 20-30 dancers up at any one time). Its not scientific but its probably not far from the actual number. Of course this does not take into account the other BKk venues such as Temptation, Casanova, Guess, KC3 - so you could add another 150 to that number.

In a nutshell you can see the same number of LB's in 2 venues in BKK versus 14 in Pattaya.

So IMHO - Pattaya has more venues with fewer staff. Bangkok has fewer venues with typically much higher numbers of staff. It makes discrete butterflying much easier in Pattaya especially if you like searching out beer bar complexes in the pursuit of new talent. If you like easy shopping - Bangkok wins hands down for pure convenience. The downside is that unlike most hypermarkets - in these 'stores' the philosophy does not seem to be 'pile it high and sell it cheap'

Cheers
Mardhi

[guydesavoy]

Thanks for that 'in a nutshell' overview  

[pacman]

(mardhi @ Nov. 10 2010,15:52) Thinking about it how do the numbers work out?

based on my own eye witness evidence of recent visits and general discussion on the forums.
Pattaya
JSB/England Bar 10
Linda Bar  8
Performance Bar 8
Ezy Bar 10
Famous Bar 12
Obsessions 20
Stringfellows 14
La Bamba  10
Koyo Bar  6
Pook Bar (combined as they keep flitting between the 2) 40
So What Bar 6
Lucky Love 6
Hi Boss 10
Naklua beer bars 10

So your at 170

Some valid observations about Pattaya versus Bangkok thanks Mardhi. I can only agree about the differences, I haven't spent enough time in Bangkok the past two years to suggest otherwise.

I will comment on the LB numbers in Pattaya based on my nightly observations between June & October this year. I acknowledge the transient nature of the typical LB but I still think you are some way short of the real figure.

Firstly, a place I know better than most - Obsessions. You estimate 20 Lbs, during my recent stay they had 44 LBs on staff.

Then there are the EZY girls, now spread between EZY, Famous Bar, Performance Bar with a few still up at the Nong Beer Bar. We all know that some of the girls flit between outlets but a total of 30 for the 3 bars is too conservative IMO. Lita recruited some new girls, Karl did have a full house even after he replaced the original EZY angels, where they are now I don't know but adding the earlier lot of girls, the latter lot plus the Famous girls, I don't think you would get change from 50.

Stringfellows & La Bamba at 14 & 10 respectively seems about right.

Koyo had more than 6 working there when I visited on several occasions. Maybe 10 is a better estimate.

Pook & Pookswan, at least 40, so no argument from me.

So What. I am not real sure but there were always a few around at the parties. Some were ring-ins I suppose but 6 seems a bit light. And Lucky Love, 6 should cover it. Then there is SuperBabies two doors away from So What with about 4 or 5. Then there are another 20 or so working in Soi 6 in GG bars. Walking down Soi 6 with old hands, they were always popping in here & there to say hello to some LB I have never seen before.

Then there is Drinking Street. I went several times with BMs just to check which LBs were on deck. Some nights there were well over 20 scattered among the bars. One bar down the back had a right crowd, very little talent unfortunately.

That would always culminate in a visit to Naklua. The Nice Bar in front of the Family Bar had at least 10 LBs working on some visits, Family Bar had about 10, plus another couple in the complex working alongside GGs.

Then there are the bars along Soi Bukhaow & in the little Sois that run off it. I saw maybe 10 but heard about many more. There were several places I couldn't find, a couple I didn't want to find but was taken there anyway, all with several LBs in them. I can only guess a number but several dozen at least, I'll settle for 20.

Then around the corner is the New Orn Bar with the lovely Jan when she is available, the popular Natalie & 3 or 4 others, usually not till very late at night. They pick off the stragglers wandering back to their hotel along Soi Diana.

In the beer bar complex next door, apart from Nong Beer Bar, there are several working there too. The tall blonde with the spiky hair was one I never caught up with despite always taking a look. I may have been lucky to miss her though.

That only leaves JSB & Linda Bar. 10 girls for JSB is a fair estimate but the place has a number of part-timers who only work when they want to who can swell that number to over double on the odd occasion. Do they count? And the same at Linda's. Remember Nana & PatPong have their students who only work weekends, more part-timers but important as they represent some of the best talent.

And Hot Tuna Bar should be included. Several are there every night. If you add the open air cocktail bar further along WS where the LBs all sit on their seats, there's another 6 or so.

Going on these numbers, that brings the number of LBs working in Pattaya up to 334. I am the first to admit there isn't a scientific census, no one can confirm exact numbers & some girls pop up at different bars during one evening. But if I had to stake my life on guestimating the numbers of LBs working in the bars of Pattaya, I would sleep much better taking a stab at 300. 170 is way too light in my book.

Others must have an opinion.

[iceberg]

Thanks Pacman for your post i think I'm going to try to copy it for my next trip but really I'm serious this is a great post about all the talent in Pattaya.One thing though I think Drinking Street doesn't allow LBs to work the bars as a good friend of mine used to work at Rainbow bar and she said she couldn't work there any more so she had to go to Pook Swan on soi buakhoa,maybe I'm mistaken so don't take this as gospel,but otherwise a great post,thank you.

[Bumpa STIKKA]

 Mardhi did say "Pattaya dedicated venues..."

Most bars have a ladyboy or three and their are hundreds of freelancers, students and shop workers.

I'd estimate there are at least 5,000 living in and around Pattaya of which around half are available in some form or another.

[iceberg]

Thank you Bumpa  and so does Pattaya!A mongerers dream.

[pacman]

(Bumpa STIKKA @ Nov. 11 2010,11:12) Mardhi did say "Pattaya dedicated venues..."

Good point! I wasn't looking for an argument, I was just adding some thoughts.

Overall, Bangkok would have many more LBs than Pattaya. (Aren't there supposed to be some 100,000 in Thailand? I saw that number quoted once.)

[deepthroat]

Pacman, I'm astonished. You have missed at least 3 girls, so the correct number would be 337.

Amazing work though, despite that silly little error. I think we should bestow the honorary title of "TLF's Semi-Official Pattaya Census Bureau" upon you. Maybe make it a Group of one?

Excellent summation.

[PigDogg]

(pacman @ Nov. 10 2010,20:38) (Aren't there supposed to be some 100,000 in Thailand? I saw that number quoted once.)

Let'so the math.    

Close to 68 million people in Thailand, so approx 34 million born with cocks.

Let's look at the 18-35 demographic, at least 20% of the population so about 7 million in that slice.

If only 1 out of 100 boys become ladyboys that would make 70,000 ladyboys age 18-35.

But I think the 1% figure (just 0.5% of the total population) is low.

Let's also assume that the number of ladyboys that come to Thailand from Laos equals the number than go to Europe from Thailand.

I think Bumpa is spot on that while very few ladyboys are prostitutes per se that perhaps 50% are available for dating or casual sex for financial consideration if approached properly by the right guy.